Big Arctic Records Package Coming

I meant to ask Frank (when I was chatting with him) who it was that steered all those Miami artists to him back in the day (loads having 45 releases on Phi-L.A. of Soul). I guess it was a radio DJ with a foot in both camps (Philly & Miami), so it was probably Douglas "Jocko" Henderson.

Phil-L.A. of Soul artist & 45 listing -- https://www.globaldogproductions.info/p/phil_la_of_soul.html

However chatting with Frank can be quite a task & I never got around to asking him the question.

Anyone here know if it was Jocko's Rocketship radio show that led to all those Florida artists hooking up with Phi-L.A. of Soul (& other Philly labels) ??

I Don't know about Jocko being the link. Know he had shows in NY and Philly, didn't realise he went as far south as Florida.

Steve

Steve, after he became 'big' in Philly & New York, his show was 'syndicated' to another 3/4 cities.

One of those was Miami (though he only actually visited the radio stn there a few times) and it's said that his 'rapping' style influenced listeners in the northern Caribbean (who could easily hear the signal emanating from the Miami radio stn).

you should probably ask jeff leimlich

I suppose it could just as easily have been Milton 'Butterball' Smith, a radio DJ at WMBM in Miami back in the 60's.

... ALSO ... weren't some of the big NARA conventions held in Miami in the 60's .... loads of contacts must have been made at those.

N.B. The above 'Butterball' not to be confused with the Philly radio DJ 'Butterball' (Joe 'Butterball' Tamburro) who just died.

Well the NARA convention was certainly held in Miami in 1959 & I believe it returned to the city before the end of the 60's ...

SEE Pages 219/ 220/ 221 of the book Voice Over: The Making of Black Radio.

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=gJuIHrKBONMC&printsec=frontcover&dq=Voice+Over:+The+Making+of+Black+Radio&source=bl&ots=3TXkyLyG5d&sig=NKgAVYawLWIiEshVsI8Mpwk6dEw&hl=en&sa=X&ei=2kAVUOGDLefT0QWSk4GIAQ&ved=0CDsQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Voice

I always had a feeling when I collected the Phil La of SOul label that the number of Florida releases was as a result of a Clarence Reid connection?

Also a few of them weren't really Fl records like Benny gordon "Give a damn", which did come out on a fl label but was originally on a SC and NY label deal that Phil -la picked up.

John,

Have PM'd you a message about Miam/Tampa.

As far as I know: Phil La of Soul was operated by Harold Lipsius in conjunction with Jesse James. The label was originally started to release product from Henry Stone's Miami set up. I think it started going wrong when the Miami artists weren't getting paid so the relationship slowly deteriorated - hence Phil La of Soul then having to source it's own 'local' product. Like many of the Jamie/Guyden labels Phil La of Soul wasn't really a 'developer' of artists careers, it sort of mirrored the smash and grab tactics that by that time, (66/67), Cameo Parkway had adopted in it's post Beatlemania death throes. By the time of it's final few 45s most of Philadelphia's musical entities were looking in another direction, (Sigma/Gamble and Huff) for their survival.

If anyone has any definitive info on the set up of Phil La of Soul I'd be most appreciative.

Regards,

Dave

John,

Have PM'd you a message about Miam/Tampa.

As far as I know: Phil La of Soul was operated by Harold Lipsius in conjunction with Jesse James. The label was originally started to release product from Henry Stone's Miami set up. I think it started going wrong when the Miami artists weren't getting paid so the relationship slowly deteriorated - hence Phil La of Soul then having to source it's own 'local' product. Like many of the Jamie/Guyden labels Phil La of Soul wasn't really a 'developer' of artists careers, it sort of mirrored the smash and grab tactics that by that time, (66/67), Cameo Parkway had adopted in it's post Beatlemania death throes. By the time of it's final few 45s most of Philadelphia's musical entities were looking in another direction, (Sigma/Gamble and Huff) for their survival.

If anyone has any definitive info on the set up of Phil La of Soul I'd be most appreciative.

Regards,

Dave

Interesting theory. I have all the records but not the facts behind the label.

Always assumed it was set up as a Philly label (based on 45s like Imperial C's, Ernestine Eady, Enamons, Herb Ward, Vicky Baines, Tony Talent's group on the label for example). I don't think it set up to release stuff from Miami, but clearly there was some tie up. Steve.

It's Frank Lipsius that now controls the Jamie / Phil-LA of Soul / Arctic catalogues & who I refer to in earlier threads.

........ Frank Lipsius: Attorney-at-Law & president of Jamie Record Co.

I guess he is Harold's brother .... is that correct ??

Is Harold still around ? (Jimmy Bishop & Jesse James seem to have 'disappeared' off the scene).

While we are on about the Philly soul scene .............

Who was Jimmie Rogers was organised Cliff Nobles MoonShot tracks ?

There are a lot of licensed in releases on the label. For example, that great expectations was a local LA release before phila of soul.

I talked to the guy who produced the alfreda brockington and the benny sigler records, he owned the lash label in philly. I can ask him more about how his stuff got licensed in if you want. btw that red star label thing that the benny sigler is on is a bootleg, not a first label or anything like that (despite what some people have paid for it...). i think it's a jamaican boot.

Hi Bob, yes we discussed the Red Star release on here about 5 years ago I think, there's another thread somewhere....

Seems that at least one Arctic act will make it over to the UK to help promote the package's release .....

https://www.allgigs.co.uk/view/event/500177/Barbara_Mason_Islington_Assembly_Hall_Town_Hall_London_4_October_2012.html

The blurb that is up on the site where you can book tickets for the Barbara Mason gig (£22 & £27.50) .........

Venue is pretty good actually, saw Lee Fields there, 5 mins from highbury & Islington station. Accoustics fine.

Will go to this "interesting minor soul performer" (where does it say that?) for sure.

Venue is pretty good actually, saw Lee Fields there, 5 mins from highbury & Islington station. Accoustics fine.

Will go to this "interesting minor soul performer" (where does it say that?) for sure.

It's on this site Steve .....

... https://tickets.ents24.com/Event/BARBARA-MASON/Islington-Assembly-Hall/649676?src=ven-670c225bae524fa1&aff=ents24

Barbara Mason was over here last year wasn't she on Giants Of Rare Groove tour? Is there just the one show?

Don't know Chalky ... but I do know that the guys selling the tickets for her Islington show are taking the mickey ....

.... Ticket cost (OK) + booking fee (well if you must) + TRANSACTION FEE (almost £4) ..... God help us !!!

Yeah I think the pckage does a tour every year, she was over with Natural Four I'm sure. At the o2 arena last time if i remember rightly.

I suppose with just one show you can get away with fleecing fans.

Last year she was part of "giants of rare groove" with Leroy H and Nat 4 at 02.

I don't think £20 /£22 for a live act is "fleecing fans" in this day and age in London Chalky. The £4 admin charges for the ticket agency is however "taking da piss". The venue has a max cap of 500 or so, and is unlikely to sell out unless there are others on (which there may be?). Lee Fields didn't sell out there, and he has a young funky fan base.

Also you should see how much the rock / pop 'munters' willingly shell out for live concerts. There's a shed load of costs and risk associated with bringing Ms. Mason and her frocks over. I have not seen her recently so don't know what she'll do, or how good her voice remains, but she's certainly a "name" to be reckoned with amongst the soul 'hoy-palloy'.

Maybe we are spoilt from the live acts we see at weekenders if we think £22 is a lot for a live performance. When we were in Chicago last year we nearly went to see a contemporary R&B / soul act (Eric Benet). Equiv of £60 for a seat about a quarter of a mile from the stage just for comparrison....Steve

Maybe we are spoilt from the live acts we see at weekenders if we think £22 is a lot for a live performance. When we were in Chicago last year we nearly went to see a contemporary R&B / soul act (Eric Benet). Equiv of £60 for a seat about a quarter of a mile from the stage just for comparrison....Steve

seeing a modern R&B or pop star isn't that comparable to seeing a nostalgia type of show. like if you went to see lady gaga or something it's definitely going to be more than $40.

It's possible that the vinyl released would be in the format of 'one side issued, flipside unnissued, or at least if I was doing this project that's how I'd do it. So what should we be hoping for on the 6 singles ? which of the released product should make up the 6 tracks?

I'll start with saying they MUST include -

Ernestine Eady ( surely one of the all time greatest female vocal Northern dancers)

Imperial C's ( imho one of the greatest group northern dancers)

what else ?

seeing a modern R&B or pop star isn't that comparable to seeing a nostalgia type of show. like if you went to see lady gaga or something it's definitely going to be more than $40.

Yes I do realise that Bob. But it is a useful comparrison. I mean she still has to eat, sleep and get here and back.

STeve

I was referring to the charges the ticket agency add on Steve for nothing next to nothing. I have no issues paying £20 to see an act, particularly if they have a good back catalogue like BM does.

I'd love to go and see her but with fuel and having to take two days off work I somehow doubt it. Why they don't schedule these shows for the weekend when the chance of ticket sales is greater is beyond me.

It's possible that the vinyl released would be in the format of 'one side issued, flipside unnissued, or at least if I was doing this project that's how I'd do it. So what should we be hoping for on the 6 singles ? which of the released product should make up the 6 tracks?

I'll start with saying they MUST include -

Ernestine Eady ( surely one of the all time greatest female vocal Northern dancers)

Imperial C's ( imho one of the greatest group northern dancers)

what else ?

I'm guessing that the target audience of a big box set like this isn't the northern soul crowd but soul music fans and collectors in general. At least with respect to that group of collectors, those aren't the highest profile acts on the label.

It's Frank Lipsius that now controls the Jamie / Phil-LA of Soul / Arctic catalogues & who I refer to in earlier threads.

........ Frank Lipsius: Attorney-at-Law & president of Jamie Record Co.

I guess he is Harold's brother .... is that correct ??

Is Harold still around ? (Jimmy Bishop & Jesse James seem to have 'disappeared' off the scene).

While we are on about the Philly soul scene .............

Who was Jimmie Rogers was organised Cliff Nobles MoonShot tracks ?

Frank is Harold's son and I seem to remember he was at uni in the UK when some of this was going on, I would have thought he would only have been involved in the very last releases by the labels if at all. I think he had an academic career until his father's age meant he helped out and finally took over at the helm. He would have been in the best possible position to get info from his dad of course. Ady

Tickets purchased looking forward to Barbara!

RE: Frank is Harold's son

Cheers for that Ady. It makes more sense than him being Harold's brother as our phone chat's ended as he was off sailing for a few weeks around the Eastern Med (when we last talked).

If he had been Harold's brother, sailing would no doubt have been too physical for him if he was the ripe old age required to be a brother.

According to CB 18/2/67 Larry Cohen was the National Sales Promo Head. The acquisition of the first record, Helene Smith master was made "by Jamie Guyden President Harold B Lipsius during his recent Miami trip".

Steve

Last year she was part of "giants of rare groove" with Leroy H and Nat 4 at 02.

I don't think £20 /£22 for a live act is "fleecing fans" in this day and age in London Chalky. The £4 admin charges for the ticket agency is however "taking da piss". The venue has a max cap of 500 or so, and is unlikely to sell out unless there are others on (which there may be?). Lee Fields didn't sell out there, and he has a young funky fan base.

Also you should see how much the rock / pop 'munters' willingly shell out for live concerts. There's a shed load of costs and risk associated with bringing Ms. Mason and her frocks over. I have not seen her recently so don't know what she'll do, or how good her voice remains, but she's certainly a "name" to be reckoned with amongst the soul 'hoy-palloy'.

Maybe we are spoilt from the live acts we see at weekenders if we think £22 is a lot for a live performance. When we were in Chicago last year we nearly went to see a contemporary R&B / soul act (Eric Benet). Equiv of £60 for a seat about a quarter of a mile from the stage just for comparrison....Steve

Speaking through experience they will be lucky to break even at £22 a ticket know matter where it's at in this country.

In fact i would go as far to say they will lose money.

Venue/doorstaff hire, PA equipment hire, Band cost including a days rehersal before hand, Backing singers, Artist and Agents fee, plus travel cost from the USA, hotels, food and so on.

Actually I've got the track listing and sleeve notes to this package and it's pretty comprehensive - people are going to love Bill Dahl's sleeve notes! Frank Lipsius is actually a major anglophile and I generally hook up with him and his wife whenever they hit these shores. I think Frank wanted to hold on releasing the info until he's 100% happy for it to go out so as soon as I get the OK I'll post the full track listing. Needless to say, it contains every Arctic and Frantic release except that weird Derek Martin release that was on some kind of reactivated Arctic which doesn't even look like it's from the same stable......

More news when I speak to Frank......

Ian D

the derek martin release was not on a reactivated arctic, it was a totally different unrelated label that existed before the philly arctic. It is the same new york label that the cadillacs are on and is the same label as the executive four on lu-bet. The label was run by Jesse Powell, who I think was a one time member and possibly the manager of the cadillacs.

sorry that should say "lu-mar" not "lu-bet". I got confused because there's an LA Lu-bet label that had a couple of releases by the explosions.

the derek martin release was not on a reactivated arctic, it was a totally different unrelated label that existed before the philly arctic. It is the same new york label that the cadillacs are on and is the same label as the executive four on lu-bet. The label was run by Jesse Powell, who I think was a one time member and possibly the manager of the cadillacs.

Yep. It didn't make much sense to me either. I was cross-checking the track-listing info for the box set with the Arctic discography on Soulful Kinda Music (see - I can be kinda sad too) and nothing about the Derek Martin record looked right to me, so Dave probably needs to remove it from the main listing.

I take it that it's a messy early to mid 60's New York dirge then?

Ian D

sorry that should say "lu-mar" not "lu-bet". I got confused because there's an LA Lu-bet label that had a couple of releases by the explosions.

Tut tut......just not good enough Bob. We expect olympian-level accuracy every time from your good self...........

Ian D

Yep. It didn't make much sense to me either. I was cross-checking the track-listing info for the box set with the Arctic discography on Soulful Kinda Music (see - I can be kinda sad too) and nothing about the Derek Martin record looked right to me, so Dave probably needs to remove it from the main listing.

I take it that it's a messy early to mid 60's New York dirge then?

Ian D

I don't know but I got it for like $3 a long time ago, played it once, don't even remember what it sounded like, I can re-listen. It's currently on Tim Brown's auction for like 800 pounds and I think Greg Tormo was saying it was good so I should probably listen again. The cadillacs isn't that good either. If someone has an executive four on lu-mar I'd trade the derek martin for it...

the derek martin release was not on a reactivated arctic, it was a totally different unrelated label that existed before the philly arctic. It is the same new york label that the cadillacs are on and is the same label as the executive four on lu-bet. The label was run by Jesse Powell, who I think was a one time member and possibly the manager of the cadillacs.

Agree 100% with this. I've seen others make this mistake in the past.

PS Ian I've got all the Arctic 45s except "Chains of love" if you need to check anything.

Anyone here got a copy of Arctic #127 ???

Frank Lipsius is looking for WAV file copies of the Kenny Gamble cuts "Keep on Smilin" and "Chains of Love".

I'm sure that he will show his appreciation to anyone who can help him out.

If you can help, drop me a personal message & I'll pass along his contact details.

....... CHEERS JOHN

Anyone here got a copy of Arctic #127 ???

Frank Lipsius is looking for WAV file copies of the Kenny Gamble cuts "Keep on Smilin" and "Chains of Love".

I'm sure that he will show his appreciation to anyone who can help him out.

If you can help, drop me a personal message & I'll pass along his contact details.

....... CHEERS JOHN

Tom Moulton mailed me before I read this thread and I've sent him the Kenny Gamble cuts tonight so job done as they say

Andy

Job done then.

CHEERS

Has any one had sight of 127 label i had the hand written label one which i sold thru Manship years ago

Has any one had sight of 127 label i had the hand written label one which i sold thru Manship years ago

Never seen one Ted .. only hand written as far as I'm aware. Don't think it got past a test press

andy

i wonder if the one i had was the only known copy

i wonder if the one i had was the only known copy

I'm not sure Ted .. if it was it's certainly done the rounds .. I thought there was at least one other

As an aside does anybody have Honey & The Bees - One Time Is Forever - Arctic 118

It's listed in discographies but I've never seen it. I was playing this out 9 or so years ago and always believed it was unreleased so I'm a little confused

Andy

This is the one I had for a dozen or more years, sold it a couple of years back, maybe three.

I offered it for sale on here at the time, but no one seemed interested.

Cheers

Mick

I'm not sure Ted .. if it was it's certainly done the rounds .. I thought there was at least one other

As an aside does anybody have Honey & The Bees - One Time Is Forever - Arctic 118

It's listed in discographies but I've never seen it. I was playing this out 9 or so years ago and always believed it was unreleased so I'm a little confused

Andy

I have the 118 Demo which of course Jimmy Bishop in his infinate wisdom had pressed singled sided. Never seen an issue though

An update on this proposed release ................. Now due December 11th and it will be quite pricey ......

....... but you do get 6 x CD's PLUS 6 x 45's PLUS a 48 page booklet full of facts.

Lots of artists represented including the main ones + the likes of Cindy Gibson, Herb Johnson, Jack & Jill, Ike & Mike, etc.

SOME unrelease stuff ain't made it onto the set though (mainly coz a 'finished master' couldn't be found) .....

so you will not get to hear the 'unfinished' Kenny Hamber & Barbara Mason duet cut ... .... or ....

.............. ...... .............. the 'unfinished' Winfield Parker & Barbara Mason duet cut

To launch the CD a New York gathering / show has been arranged for December 6th .... for press types & artist guests only .....

Frank has organised a coach to take lots of people up from Philly. Kenny Hamber will be performing at the event ......

.... others in attendance will include Winfield Parker, members of the Volcanoes, Ambassadors, Honey & the Bee, etc.

Kenny has told me that he can take a couple of guests along, so if you're near NY and can make it on that evening, drop me a pm and I'll put a couple of SSers in touch with Kenny to see if he will take you along (or have your names added to the guest list).

£85 on amazon, almost $119 on cduniverse. Why don't they sell it without the 45's?

Frank only wants to sell it as 'the whole damn thing'.

Doesn't stop people buying the set & 'breakin it up' to sell on .......

the Cd's to folk that buy CD's & the 45's on ebay for $$$$$$