On what releases does the full spoken intro version from the LP appear. The U.S. Strata East 45 doesn't have it, it is a edited version. Just found a French 45 copy and this has the spoken intro and seems to be the full 5.14 version. Anyone one know about other release of it, ie Dutch, Belgium

Cheers

Dave

Hi Dave,

The spanish issue (live recording) have the spoken intro. IMHO this is best than the studio cut for the dance floor.

Cheeers!!

Hi Dave,

The spanish issue (live recording) have the spoken intro. IMHO this is best than the studio cut for the dance floor.

Cheeers!!

Is this the version that came out on Arista in the states?

Is this the version that came out on Arista in the states?

I've got a UK Arista 12" of this and I'm pretty sure it's a live version, on a B side. Might be the same in the States.

I've got a UK Arista 12" of this and I'm pretty sure it's a live version, on a B side. Might be the same in the States.

Thanks Pete

Pretty sure the spanish 45 must be the Arista version.

On what releases does the full spoken intro version from the LP appear. The U.S. Strata East 45 doesn't have it, it is a edited version. Just found a French 45 copy and this has the spoken intro and seems to be the full 5.14 version. Anyone one know about other release of it, ie Dutch, Belgium

Cheers

Dave

UK Champagne (7") with spoken version on one side, and whitout on the other side!

Edited November 3, 201014 yr by Tommy1

UK Champagne (7") with spoken version on one side, and whitout on the other side!

I've got the 12" on this, how long is the 7" track ?

I've got the 12" on this, how long is the 7" track ?

Have to check at home, but I think it's full lenght

Edited November 3, 201014 yr by Tommy1

On what releases does the full spoken intro version from the LP appear. The U.S. Strata East 45 doesn't have it, it is a edited version. Just found a French 45 copy and this has the spoken intro and seems to be the full 5.14 version. Anyone one know about other release of it, ie Dutch, Belgium

Cheers

Dave

Did the US Strata East version come out at the time of 'Winter In America' when it was played as a new release?

Mike

dave,

would it be correct to think then, that when it was played at the casino, it would have been from the lp?, because i remember the full spoken intro there. i have a dutch arista in a picture sleeve BUT the intro is shorter, yet its still 5 mins long

I've got the 12" on this, how long is the 7" track ?

I have a Belgium 7" ( Snow # SN001 , 1978 ) , which has the spoke intro , and the running time is 5 : 14 .

Malc

dave,

would it be correct to think then, that when it was played at the casino, it would have been from the lp?, because i remember the full spoken intro there. i have a dutch arista in a picture sleeve BUT the intro is shorter, yet its still 5 mins long

As far as I remember U.S. 45 was released around the time of the original LP. But when it was first played on the northern scene, The Mecca and then Wigan and a host of other venues it was from the LP with the spoken intro. I don't think the French one or the Dutch one came out until a year later and I think few were even aware that it had come out over there.

I have a Belgium 7" ( Snow # SN001 , 1978 ) , which has the spoke intro , and the running time is 5 : 14 .

Malc

Thought the Belgian one had the "uno dos ...." but missed the "drunken" bit ?

Cheers Paul

Thought the Belgian one had the "uno dos ...." but missed the "drunken" bit ?

Cheers Paul

Your right, it comes in straight on the count in intro, but with out the drunken part as with the original LP, Champagne 12"/7" and the French 45

Mines got the drunken intro says somthing about rembering the a laugh then the count in, Mines the French release with pic sleave

Strata-East

No 2c004-96,722

Stereo 1975

Time 5'14

Its Got a silver star printed on the lable And a anti slip ring around the edge

Hope that helps

Edited November 3, 201014 yr by miff

Champaign 12", full spoken intro and then the countdown.

Champaign 12", full spoken intro and then the countdown.

I've just listened to my original Winter In America LP and the drunken mix on the Champagne 7' and they are not the same. On my LP you can barely hear Gil saying 'If I can just remember' before the count in, on the 7 inch you hear him quite clearly say it twice. Is this the same for everyone, and as such is this the only place the full intro is available.

Dean

Mines got the drunken intro says somthing about rembering the a laugh then the count in, Mines the French release with pic sleave

Strata-East

No 2c004-96,722

Stereo 1975

Time 5'14

Its Got a silver star printed on the lable And a anti slip ring around the edge

Then there must exist two different french demo/promo pressings of "The Bottle".

My copy looks exactly the same as yours, but the matrix details seems to be different (from what I can see in your scan).

The matrix details on mine (which has got the version that starts with the count-in) are as follows:

"The Bottle" side:

M3 308552 1

96772 A 22

"Back Home" side:

M3 308553 1

96772 B 22

What are the details on your copy?

Edited November 4, 201014 yr by Sebastian

Then there must exist two different french demo/promo pressings of "The Bottle".

My copy looks exactly the same as yours, but the matrix details seems to be different (from what I can see in your scan).

The matrix details on mine (which has got the version that starts with the count-in) are as follows:

"The Bottle" side:

M3 308552 1

96772 A 22

"Back Home" side:

M3 308553 1

96772 B 22

What are the details on your copy?

On the Bottle side

SP 399A

96772 A 21

M3 301861 1

Back Home Side

SP 399 B 21

96272 B

M3 3078261 1

Wondering if the SP stands for Spanish now, onlt reason said it was French is it says made in France on the lable ??

Is mine a Demo then ?

Edited November 4, 201014 yr by miff

Wondering if the SP stands for Spanish now, onlt reason said it was French is it says made in France on the lable ??

Is mine a Demo then ?

Thanks for the matrix info. Definitely two different pressings confirmed.

I think that both are french pressings, but perhaps made at different times or targetting different markets etc.

Your copy has got a lower M3-number so yours is probably the earlier of the two pressing.

Perhaps radio DJs complained about the spoken intro and when the record label did the next batch they edited it out? Hard to know.

I also just noticed that on my copy the label credits are different.

My copy credits "GIL SCOTT-HERON and BRIAN JACKSON".

Your copy only credits "GIL SCOTT-HERON"

Check out the scans below (mine is to the left):

Edited November 4, 201014 yr by Sebastian

As far as I remember U.S. 45 was released around the time of the original LP. But when it was first played on the northern scene, The Mecca and then Wigan and a host of other venues it was from the LP with the spoken intro. I don't think the French one or the Dutch one came out until a year later and I think few were even aware that it had come out over there.

appologies dave, mine's on snow which is belgian ( dont think it helps with no glasses on!) and it dosnt have the drunken rambling just the count-in. guess it helps to have a soundburger handy when attempting to buy what you think is the original version, its certainly confusing with so many different european releases.

Thanks for the matrix info. Definitely two different pressings confirmed.

I think that both are french pressings, but perhaps made at different times or targetting different markets etc.

Your copy has got a lower M3-number so yours is probably the earlier of the two pressing.

Perhaps radio DJs complained about the spoken intro and when the record label did the next batch they edited it out? Hard to know.

I also just noticed that on my copy the label credits are different.

My copy credits "GIL SCOTT-HERON and BRIAN JACKSON".

Your copy only credits "GIL SCOTT-HERON"

Check out the scans below (mine is to the left):

Oh yes, the Pic cover states Gil Scott Heron & Brain Jackson, so have I got the wrong Pic cover ???

So let see if we can make sence of this

7" records

U.S. Strata East, edited no intro

French 1st press Strata East, no picture sleeve , full drunken intro

French 2nd press Strata East, picture bag, full drunken intro

Dutch Snow label, picture bag, edited intro, only count in

U.K. Champaign label, no picture bag, full drunken intro

Spanish, Arista ?, later arista live recording ?

Just checked my french one and it also only states Gil-Scott Heron with a picture bag and it came from a french distributor, so have amended below based on this

So let see if we can make sence of this

7" records

U.S. Strata East, edited no intro

French 1st press Strata East, picture sleeve? , credited Gil-Scott Heron/Brian Jackson, full drunken intro

French 2nd press Strata East, picture bag, credited Gil-Scott Heron, full drunken intro

Dutch Snow label, picture bag, edited intro, only count in

U.K. Champaign label, no picture bag, full drunken intro

Spanish, Arista ?, later arista live recording ?

French 1st press Strata East, picture sleeve? , credited Gil-Scott Heron/Brian Jackson, full drunken intro

French 2nd press Strata East, picture bag, credited Gil-Scott Heron, full drunken intro

I think both french pressings came in that cartoon sleeve.

Also the pressing order is the other way around, the second pressing has only got the count-in intro.

French 1st press Strata East, picture bag, full drunken intro (credited Gil-Scott Heron on label)

French 2nd press Strata East, picture bag, edited intro, only count in (credited Gil-Scott Heron/Brian Jackson on label)

Edited November 4, 201014 yr by Sebastian

Hi Seb

Getting a little confused here

I have the pressing credited to Gil-Scott Heron only, with a picture bag and it has the full drunken intro. Is this the second or first pressing. Got this from a french warehouse/shop find.

Hi Seb

Getting a little confused here

I have the pressing credited to Gil-Scott Heron only, with a picture bag and it has the full drunken intro. Is this the second or first pressing. Got this from a french warehouse/shop find.

As far as the french pressing goes...

The "drunken intro" one has got the following matrix:

M3 301861 1 and 96772 A 21 and SP 399A

The "count-in intro" one has got the following matrix:

M3 308552 1 and 96772 A 22

NOTE the higher numbers in the "count-in" matrix (underlined above). It is most likely the later pressing.

Edited November 4, 201014 yr by Sebastian

Any help here

Here is the french white demo followed by the two french issues.

NOTE the different catalogue number on the demo SP 399 which also can be found in the matrix of the "drunken intro" issue:

I recently posted a want here for the US Arista single (AS 0225,1976). It proved far harder to find than I'd ever imagined, but I eventually got a copy where somebody had tried to clean the styrene with some kind of solvent. It looks horrible but plays reasonably well.

Timings are 3:55 for the A side, 3:58 for the B side.

This is an edited version of the "It's Your World" live recording, but with overdubbed horns which don't appear on the album version. This is the variant with the longest spoken intro: "Help us out Brian" etc. In my opinion this is the ultimate version and makes the Strata East cut sound very static.

I'd still like a really clean copy if anyone has one.

Edited November 5, 201014 yr by garethx

the uk issue of the live version , is on the b side of hello sunday hello road , arista 169 ,

its starts off , brian jackson on flute for yea , will give us a bit of help here , then kicks in , best version for me if im honest

Mines got the drunken intro says somthing about rembering the a laugh then the count in, Mines the French release with pic sleave

Strata-East

No 2c004-96,722

Stereo 1975

Time 5'14

Its Got a silver star printed on the lable And a anti slip ring around the edge

Hope that helps

Mine's the same as this!! Time 5.14 on french!

So how hard is the US Strata East 45 given that no one had it when it was a new release? Mike

So let see if we can make sence of this

7" records

U.S. Strata East, edited no intro

French 1st press Strata East, no picture sleeve , full drunken intro

French 2nd press Strata East, picture bag, full drunken intro

Dutch Snow label, picture bag, edited intro, only count in

U.K. Champaign label, no picture bag, full drunken intro

Spanish, Arista ?, later arista live recording ?

you will have to slide neils inferno release 7" and 12" above the champagne release, i can think of at least six u.k releases [including arista] but inferno was the first 7" and that also makes it the first 12" release 'anywhere' [of the studio version]

So how hard is the US Strata East 45 given that no one had it when it was a new release? Mike

That's a very good question Mike.

The wikipedia entry for Winter In America* claims the 45 was a sizable R&B hit at the time (#15). This doesn't seem to square with the evidence which suggests that the US Strata East 45 is not exactly plentiful. I've even heard it claimed that this particular 45 is a downright bootleg and was categorically not issued at the time. Perhaps the various European issues were imported back to the States for the record to receive club and radio spins.

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_in_America

As I mentioned in my post above I found the US Arista 45 of the live edit from the It's Your World live album extremely difficult to turn up. The US promo 12" from 1976 (with The Glitter Band's "Makes You Blind" on the reverse) is offered for sale far more frequently, yet still fetches decent money:

https://www.popsike.com/php/quicksearch.php?pagenum=1&searchtext=gil+scott+heron+bottle&incldescr=&sortord=dprice&thumbs=&currsel=

That's a very good question Mike.

The wikipedia entry for Winter In America* claims the 45 was a sizable R&B hit at the time (#15). This doesn't seem to square with the evidence which suggests that the US Strata East 45 is not exactly plentiful. I've even heard it claimed that this particular 45 is a downright bootleg and was categorically not issued at the time. Perhaps the various European issues were imported back to the States for the record to receive club and radio spins.

* https://en.wikipedia....nter_in_America

As I mentioned in my post above I found the US Arista 45 of the live edit from the It's Your World live album extremely difficult to turn up. The US promo 12" from 1976 (with The Glitter Band's "Makes You Blind" on the reverse) is offered for sale far more frequently, yet still fetches decent money:

https://www.popsike.c...humbs=&currsel=

Yep. It is a good question.

I have a U.S. Strata East 7" promo from 1974 - SES-19742-45A with "Back Home" on the B side which sure looks legit to me. I'll post a scan up tomorrow. I'm pretty sure I acquired this in the states in the mid 80's. Also I'm pretty sure it has the drunken intro but I'll check tomorrow. I've never seen another Strata East 7" promo so I have nothing to compare it to. However, this was a breakaway tune for this little New York indie and the hip New York clubs were featuring this at the same time as it was becoming a monster on the UK scene, so it kinda made sense that they would press some 7" promos to score some radio plays. But I reckon it's rare.

I kept the French one for a while 'cos that was a nice pressing anyway but I let it go 'cos I couldn't justify 1 U.S. promo 45, I French 45, 1 UK 45 and 1 UK 12", 1 Winter In America album plus numerous comps. I mean, great record but how many copies can you actually use LOL........

Ian D

you will have to slide neils inferno release 7" and 12" above the champagne release, i can think of at least six u.k releases [including arista] but inferno was the first 7" and that also makes it the first 12" release 'anywhere' [of the studio version]

Feel free to add more to the listing

Go here for the best never-released GSH & BJ live concert ever IMO including an amazing 15 mins+ version of the bottle

https://neverenoughrhodes.blogspot.com/2008/09/gil-scott-heron-live-at-bottom-line.html

this is so much better than 'it's your world', enjoy! it's been freely available for years on the web.

the 15 minute version of 'home is where the hatred is' is pretty amazing too.

cheers Sutty

Edited November 6, 201014 yr by Sutty

Feel free to add more to the listing

On the flip to the UK 12 of "Space Shuttle" (Castle Communications) 1990...........count intro misses drunken bit

Cheers Paul

OK, here is the U.S. promo of "The Bottle"

A Side

B Side

Ian D

A couple of slightly bigger scans of the US demo and issue from Popsike:

A couple of slightly bigger scans of the US demo and issue from Popsike:

Yeah, sorry Sebastian. My scanning skills leave a bit to be desired but I guess we can now confirm that the U.S. copies exist on both issue and promo.........

Ian D

I picked up a Canadian Arista issue at the weekend and was disappointed to find it was a "live" version with lots of bongo's? Did this come out anywhere else?

I picked up a Canadian Arista issue at the weekend and was disappointed to find it was a "live" version with lots of bongo's? Did this come out anywhere else?

Came out on a 12ich in the UK newer with "Hello Sunday, Hello Road" as the "A" side.

Also on a US LP I believe

Cheers Paul

if it's the same as the USA Arista copy it's THE version in my opinion

I think that this might be the Spanish issue that Dave mentions it looks to be a later issue dating from 1977. Picked it up recently.

 

Edited January 10, 201510 yr by Millo