Following on from a post made by RobbK in the Judy Highes thread. There are Jobete songs that were recorded and released by non-Motown/label artists. However, perhaps some of these songs may have been recorded by Motown artists and could be lurking on tapes in the archives.

1. Can any of you list any non-Motown Jobete songs.

and

2. Perhaps suggest Motown artists you would like to uncover an unreleased version by.

3. Have these archives already been checked over many times (in which case, end of thread!)

I'd be interested at least!! (and my Motown knowledge is limited)

Cheers

KB

E.G.

I didn't know about this Kim Weston - You Hit Me, track until Robb's post.

https://youtu.be/KHlomLGgb38

Cheers

Three Northern classics off the top of my head from the Jobete catalogue:

Paris Sleepless Nights Doc

Sandy Wynns The Touch Of Venus Champion

Eric Mercury & The Soul Searchers Lonely Girl Sac

Sparkels Try Love Old Town

Charlotta Tillman Baby I'm Serious Jubilee

Hmmm.... I'd like to hear ANY Motown artist sing Sleepless Nights, as I think the Paris version is out of tune and off key in far too many places!

Ike & Tina Turner Somebody, Somewhere Loma (and by association Darrell Banks version on Revilot) are Jobete songs too, as is of course "Lonely Lover" by Jimmy McFarland (with recordings in the can by Marvin Gaye and The Four Tops which have seen light subsequently).

The Paris record is an interesting one. On ebay a few years ago a copy turned up with maybe more WOL than I've ever seen on a record. It was in fact a dedication to the artist (who was referred to as 'David') by all those who played or sang background on the session. It was basically everyone in the Motown LA office at the time, the Holloway sisters, Frank Wilson, Marc Gordon, Morris Chestnut from The Vows etc. I don't know if it's been definitively proven that Paris was the same guy who recorded on 4J but "Sleepless Nights" has always struck me as a bit of a vanity recording by a non-professional singer. Maybe he was their dentist or accountant.

Sandy Wynns 45 similarly appeared on the mysterious "DOC" label (as well as on Champion) which has a Pennsylvania address on what is clearly a West Coast disc to presumably throw people off the scent of a 'moonlighting' Motown release.

Edited April 30, 201213 yr by garethx

Just listening to the other side of the Paris 45 (a Jobete song too) "Wishing Well" and his voice on that is excellent; clearly the same guy as on Uni and 4J as 'Mr Tears (Paris)'.

According to John Ridley's website his real name was Ekundayo Paris and he was and is a songwriter of some repute, responsible for, of all things, Robbie Williams "Rock DJ" through it's sampling of Barry White's "It's Ecstasy When You Lay Down Next To Me".

Modern Records seemed to have access to a few non-Motown Jobetes-

Mary Love- "You Turned My Bitter Into Sweet"

Mary Love- "Hey Stoney Face"

Ikettes- "i'm So Thankful"

Here's a few more for the list-

Connie Clark- "My Sugar Baby" - there is an unreleased (at the time) version by Frank Wilson

Tamala Lewis- "You Won't Say Nothin' "

Magnificents- "My Heart Is Calling You" - unreleased ( at the time)) version by the Four Tops

Doni Burdick- "Bari Track"- shows up as Jobete even though it's an instrumental version

of "I Miss My Baby" by Rose Battiste which is not a Jobete song.

Pat Hunt on Grand.

Can somebody put up label scans of the Charlotte Tillman and Pat Hunt 45s ... both sides if they are Jobete

I'd like to see all the credits

Thanks

Andy

Betty La Vette - I'm Holding On - Big Wheel

Lonely Lover was the only issue of the Jimmy Mc Farland's version but more still in the can.

Edited May 2, 201213 yr by Prophonics 2029

Eric Mercury & The Soul Searchers Lonely Girl Sac

Sparkels Try Love Old Town

Not sure if I fully understand the original question but these songs were done by Motown artists, although unreleased.

(NB: not 100% sure about Sparkels)

unreleased take of the Sparkels was recorded by Norma Jenkins, a non-Motown artist. So it doesn't qualify for this thread does it? Lonely girl was done by Brenda Holloway titled "Lonely boy".

Edited May 2, 201213 yr by Benji

Can somebody put up label scans of the Charlotte Tillman and Pat Hunt 45s ... both sides if they are Jobete

I'd like to see all the credits

Thanks

Andy

I've posted a scan of the A in the gallery as I can't get it to link here, same credits on both sides )from memory.

There is a scan of Pat Hunt on Sir Shamblings site.

https://www.sirshambling.com/artists_2012/H/pat_hunt/index.php

Edited May 2, 201213 yr by Tony Smith

Just listening to the other side of the Paris 45 (a Jobete song too) "Wishing Well" and his voice on that is excellent; clearly the same guy as on Uni and 4J as 'Mr Tears (Paris)'.

According to John Ridley's website his real name was Ekundayo Paris and he was and is a songwriter of some repute, responsible for, of all things, Robbie Williams "Rock DJ" through it's sampling of Barry White's "It's Ecstasy When You Lay Down Next To Me".

Hi Gareth, Whats the record on Uni by him, I have the others. Didn't that disc on Ebay say Paris The Whoosie?

Edited May 2, 201213 yr by Prophonics 2029

Bobby Callender - My baby changes like the weather - Bamboo.

regards Ricardo.

noticed yesterday that...

ollie jackson / wipe away the tear drops / magnum was jobette pub

(or is this different with 2 t' in jobette)

Shirley Gunter - Stuck Up - Tangerine (penned by Chester and Gary Pitkin)

Bettye Swann - You Gave me Love - Money (penned by Arthur Wright and Betty Swann)

(and the flip - Dont Look Back)

steve

Bobby Callender - My baby changes like the weather - Bamboo.

regards Ricardo.

Not sure if this fits the bill cause Smokey Robinson released a version on LP.

Not sure if this fits the bill cause Smokey Robinson released a version on LP.

OOPS..................

roddie joy - is there anything else you want - red bird

margorie black - one more hurt - sue

......the list quite honestly, is endless, oh, and i think "sleepless nights" was scheduled originally for the four tops

Thanks Tony .....

Roddie Joy is Trio Music and Marjorie Black is Sagittarius/Durbrina ... the Bob Bateman involvement gives them the Detroit feel but they are not Jobete I'm afraid

A

Several Coral releases were Jobete, presumably because of Berry's relationship with Brunswick.

Exotics - Like You Hurt Me - Coral

Exotics - Let's Get Together - Coral

Frances Burnett - Sweetie - Coral

Frances Burnett - I Love Him So - Coral (Written by Berry & Smokey)

Frances Burnett - Too Proud - Coral

Frances Burnett - How I Miss You So - Coral etc.

Sean

Edited May 2, 201213 yr by Sean Hampsey

A few from me ....

Judy Hughes - Fine Fine Fine - Vault ... as a West Coast song probably best suited to the Lewis Sisters but a Brenda, or Patrice, version would be pretty amazing

The Sparkels - Try Love - Old Town -.. aside from the 'Jobete' demo by Norma Jenkins I think this would have been good by the Marvelettes

Lollipops - Love Is The Only Answer - RCA .... the Velvelettes would have done this one justice

Barbara Lewis - Spend a Little Time - Atlantic ... would have suited Mary or Kim

Tamiko (Jones) - Don't Laugh If I Cry (At Your Party) - Atco .... Kim would have sounded good on this

Frances Burnett - How I Miss You So - Coral .... probably the Miracles with Claudette on lead

Jeanie King - You've Got A Good Thing Going - General American ... Carolyn Crawford or LaBrenda Ben

Bobby Moore - I Carefully Checked Your Heart - Kay-O .. Temptations with Paul Williams on lead

Sandra Phillips - World Without Sunshine - ... maybe one for Tammi

Andy

The Sparkels - Try Love - Old Town -.. aside from the 'Jobete' demo by Norma Jenkins I think this would have been good by the Marvelettes

Lollipops - Love Is The Only Answer - RCA .... the Velvelettes would have done this one justice

Barbara Lewis - Spend a Little Time - Atlantic ... would have suited Mary or Kim

Tamiko (Jones) - Don't Laugh If I Cry (At Your Party) - Atco .... Kim would have sounded good on this

Sandra Phillips - World Without Sunshine - ... maybe one for Tammi

These came all from the NY Jobete office didn't they? Sid Barnes, George Kerr ,etc.

Chester St. Anthony (aka Frank Wilson) - Togethere Always Together - A&M .... without a doubt Marvin

Vala-Quons - Window Shopping On Girl's Avenue - Tangerine ... possibly the Valadiers or Mike & Modifiers

Andy

wondered if Clay hunt - Since I lost you?

These came all from the NY Jobete office didn't they? Sid Barnes, George Kerr ,etc.

Indeed they did .. a combination of Kerr, Barnes, Harris, Singleton & Ossman compositions

Andy

wondered if Clay hunt - Since I lost you?

A cover version of Jimmy Ruffin on Soul as opposed to the strict definition of this topic (a Jobete song where the released version was non-Motown recorded or released and where there was no contemporary Motown release).

For what it's worth the Clay Hunt cut is far superior to Jimmy Ruffin's in my opinion.

A cover version of Jimmy Ruffin on Soul as opposed to the strict definition of this topic (a Jobete song where the released version was non-Motown recorded or released and where there was no contemporary Motown release).

For what it's worth the Clay Hunt cut is far superior to Jimmy Ruffin's in my opinion.

I did wonder on that one, haven't heard the Ruffin version, but clays such a track,

so back on thread then...

Laura Johnson - wondering if you miss me (on brent) .... not got my copy to hand but 99% sure its jobete related. Anyone know of an issue??

Edited May 3, 201213 yr by tiggerwoods

Laura Johnson - wondering if you miss me (on brent) .... not got my copy to hand but 99% sure its jobete related. Anyone know of an issue??

I don't know this ... any chance of a scan ?

Andy

Laura Johnson - wondering if you miss me (on brent) .... not got my copy to hand but 99% sure its jobete related. Anyone know of an issue??

Lovely old tune, and yes it is Jobete.

Both Issues and Demo's are White, so you may have seen an Issue and took it for a Demo.

Sean

Jobete was motown's publilshing arm but it was operated as a publishing company and not just a company to publish motown songs, right? Just the other day someone was telling me that he wrote some songs in the late 70s that Jobete published. I don't know if there was any specific intent for a motown artist to record them. I always assumed that the valaquans, for example, was never recorded by or even intended to be recorded by a motown artist.

I think what you say is true to an extent Bob, but the fact remains that the vast majority of the 1960s Jobete catalogue was recorded in-house and the main mechanism which ensured that was Producer contracts.

Most of the people who had instant access to the songs were contracted producer-writers who couldn't have overseen outside recordings under their own names anyway. A number of the examples mentioned above were non-Detroit originated songs where the writers-producers were not necessarily under exclusive contract: Sidney Barnes/George Kerr etc. in New York and Frank Wilson/Marc Gordon/The Pipkin Brothers in LA. Also there are a number of examples from the Pre-Pop hit period where the Producer contract system might not have been as securely tied down.

In a relatively vast 1960s catalogue of songs the amount which never saw a Motown producer or any number of signed acts attempt them is still pretty limited. Jobete came to become synonymous with Motown. A blessing in some ways but a curse in others.

As the 1960s wore on the powers that be were keen to get the catalogue of songs performed by as broad a cast of performers as they could in the 'white bread' world. One of the ways they tried to do this was having songs placed on the albums of the big crossover entertainers such as Dean Martin and so on. The Jobete moniker may have scared off some potential customers because of the above mentioned synonymity, so other brands were bought into the publishing fold like Stone Agate Music.

"For Once In My Life" was written specifically to be a 'modern standard' which consumers were meant to assume was a far older piece of music. A new publishing company, Stein & Van Stock, was created specifically for songs such as these: songs generated in-house but not meant to lead to typical Motown arrangements or treatments. The name was meant to conjure images of some of the older Tin Pan Alley publishers.

After the move to Los Angeles the company was so different in so many ways to what went before, and I suppose your late '70s example is symptomatic of that change. 1970s Motown still made many good records, but the homogeneity of sound and approach was largely no longer there.

Also a good publisher will try to find the correct vehicle to sell as many records as possible with any given song. In the classic Motown period it was the signed artists and producers who could pretty much guarantee this outcome.

The fascinating thing to hear would be first hand accounts of how exactly such songs as "Lonely Girl" or "Lonely Lover" made their way onto what were pretty much 'Mom and Pop' labels.

I can think of one example of a record which doesn't fit into many of the broad categories above: Nick Ashford's "When I Feel The Need" on Verve. A Jobete song and one where Nick Ashford was on a producer-writer contract, but only specifically as part of the Ashford-Simpson duo and was presumably briefly free to try his hand as an artist on another label. Marvin Gaye's powerhouse rendition was left in the can for any number of reasons we can only guess at now.

Edited May 3, 201213 yr by garethx

Here's one more-

John Wesley- "Love Is Such A Funny Thing" - Melic

Was Gene Chandler "Check Yourself" recorded by any motown artists? It's Jobete and was co-written by Gordy.

Jacob

Garethx: not disagreeing with anything you are writing, just pointing out that although it mostly published songs recorded by motown artists, it did do some publishing of non-motown songs by independent songwriters, so not all songs were recorded by or even intended to be recorded by motown artists. I appreciate all the context you added -- I didn't realize that they had some songwriters under exclusive contract. I also never knew about the other publishing companies motown established with other goals. Thanks for all the details.

Was Gene Chandler "Check Yourself" recorded by any motown artists? It's Jobete and was co-written by Gordy.

Jacob

There is a "Check Yourself" by the Temptations on Miracle- not sure if it's the same song.

There is a "Check Yourself" by the Temptations on Miracle- not sure if it's the same song.

it is the same song.

before anybody confuses this thread every time a song with this title comes up -- it is different than the intruders / IAP company song

I don't know this ... any chance of a scan ?

Andy

I would with pleasure andy but don't have the facility ..... chris anderton was after one a while back.....if he has one he may upload for you....is it googleable??

Phil

Several Coral releases were Jobete, presumably because of Berry's relationship with Brunswick.

Exotics - Like You Hurt Me - Coral

Exotics - Let's Get Together - Coral

Frances Burnett - Sweetie - Coral

Frances Burnett - I Love Him So - Coral (Written by Berry & Smokey)

Frances Burnett - Too Proud - Coral

Frances Burnett - How I Miss You So - Coral etc.

Sean

Frances Burnett's cuts were related to Berry Gordy's involvement with Brunswick with Jackie Wilson, but The Exotics' cuts were due to a relationship of their management with the Jobete Music's New York office's writers/producers (George Kerr, and maybe Eddie Singleton). The Sparkels, Pets, Tamala Lewis, Roy Handy and others sang Jobete songs from that source.

The Paris and Sandy Wynns releases on Doc Records were Hal Davis' and Edd Cobb's attempt to get those cuts better distribution in The East Coast, rather than to "hide" the fact that they were "moonlighting" from their work at L.A.'s Jobete Music Office. Davis, Frank Wilson, Marc Gordan, Al Capps, Willie Hutchison and H.B. Barnum were all releasing their own productions of Jobete songs by their own L.A. non-Motown artists on labels such as Modern/Kent, Joker, Power, Tollie, Dee Gee, etc., and Motown knew about that. They did NOT have exclusive contracts to produce only for Motown. They were allowed to use their songs written for Motown in their non-Motown productions, if after a certain time period, Motown chose not to have their own release of the given song.

I looked through The Motown Vaults for songs to place on Motown "Oldies" archive series "From The Vaults" in the 1970s. There were so many recordings, we just couldn't get to it all. I am still hearing new vinyl-unreleased Motown recordings all the time as Harry Weinger & crew "discover" them. I didn't know, back in te old days, that Motown artists had recorded "I'm So Thankful", "You Hit Me(Right Where it Hurt Me)", "My Heart is Calling You", and several others.

"The Touch of Venus" was recorded by Patrice Holloway for Motown. I'd be curious to know if Motown artists recorded any of the Tamala Lewis, Roy Handy, Pets, Sparkels, Exotics or other NY Jobete songs, and if they recorded any of the Judy Hughes, Pat Hunt, Cinderellas, Mary Love, Connie Clark, Ricardo Lewis, Paris, Autographs, etc. L.A. Jobete cuts.

I'm most interested to hear Motown versions of "You Turned My Bitter into Sweet" and "Let Me Know" done by Mary Love, "Just Call On Me" by Eddie (Frank) Wilson and "Love's Gonna Do You In" by The Autographs. I'd bet that no Motown artists recorded "You Won't Say Nothin' " by Tamala Lewis, or any others of the George Clinton or Kerr and Barnes non-Motown releases (Dolls, Norma Jenkins, Roy Handy, Pets, Sparkels, etc. ). It's a shame that Gordy shut down the New York Jobete office before Motown could get the rights to "That Was My Girl" (Parliaments). I'm sure that George Clinton wrote that originally to sell to Jobete Music for The Temptations to sing. It's a great Wingate production, but I'd have liked to hear a Motown-recorded version (even with the same Parliaments' vocals,-or sung by The Temptations).

Too bad Ed Cobb left Motown because they didn't want to give him production credit and pay for his production of "Every Little Bit Hurts" by Brenda Holloway. IF he HAD stayed with Motown, maybe "Run One Flight of Stairs" and some of the other great Gloria Jones cuts would have been recorded by The Funk Brothers, and Gloria Jones would have been signed to Motown in 1964, rather than waiting until the 1970s.

wondered if Clay hunt - Since I lost you?

That was originally recorded by Jimmy Ruffin. Clay Hunt's version was recorded later. That was just a situation in which his producer chose a Jobete published song for his artist to sing. That's totally different from my quest to hear Motown-recorded versions of songs written by out-of-Detroit Jobete music contracted writer/producers, who were writing songs to sell to Motown.

Laura Johnson - wondering if you miss me (on brent) .... not got my copy to hand but 99% sure its Jobete related. Anyone know of an issue??

Laura Johnson recorded for Correc-Tone Records (produced by Robert Bateman) in 1962. Owner, Wilbur Golden was short on production money, so he leased that record to Brent records in New York. "Wondering If You Miss Me" was a Correc-Tone song, which would have been published by Bateman's Brianbert Music. But He and Golden also sold the publishing rights to it to Brent Music. It was the flip side (A-side) of that release that was the Jobete song ("I Know How It Feels"), which was a remake of a Motown original production sung by Bateman's own Satintones. That was a case of Bateman just recording his own song two years later. Robert Bateman, Sonny Sanders and Popcorn Wylie (and The Satintones-partly reformed as The Pyramids) had all left Motown in early 1962 to join Wilbur Golden's Correc-Tone/SonBert Records. Brian Holland and Mickey Stevenson had told them about making the move (they had first planned to move first, but later decided to stay at Motown).

A very interesting post Robb, but pretty much bears out what I was trying to get at above. It seems the majority of the tracks this topic throws up originated in the non-Detroit offices. The instances of Motown's Detroit employees producing or writing for 'outside' artists during what we think of as the company's heyday are pretty-much non-existent.

The New York and Los Angeles offices seem to have operated in an entirely different way to the Detroit base. The New York experiment was abandoned pretty quickly and seemed to be more or less an attempt to get Miss Ray out of the picture in Detroit. In any case I'm trying hard to think about any artists or producers who made the jump from that situation to long-lasting involvement with the mainstream company (of course there are figures like Robert Bateman Bob Staunton who contributed but were hardly mainstays like Smokey or the Hollands or Norman Whitfield were in Detroit).

LA was different again and as you say all the production or writing personnel seemed relatively free to carry on their involvement with other record companies and that office at least 'found' Brenda Holloway, even if her initial success did indeed lead to rancour and fall-out for some of the creative talent involved. Also worth mentioning that Jobete's LA office gave the young Jimmy Webb his start as a salaried professional songwriter.

I would with pleasure andy but don't have the facility ..... chris anderton was after one a while back.....if he has one he may upload for you....is it googleable??

Phil

Found it but it's listed as Brent Music

Andy

Here's one more-

John Wesley- "Love Is Such A Funny Thing" - Melic

Good call .. this isn't listed in the Jobete catalog .. I guess he covered the Williams & Watson LP track

Anybody able to clarify which came first and if it credits Jobete on the LP

Andy

Good call .. this isn't listed in the Jobete catalog .. I guess he covered the Williams & Watson LP track

Anybody able to clarify which came first and if it credits Jobete on the LP

Andy

No Jobete credit on the LP sleeve - it states all selections are BMI.

Label just has the writers credit.

No Jobete credit on the LP sleeve - it states all selections are BMI.

Label just has the writers credit.

Thanks

Appreciate you taking the time to check

andy