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Is It Ok To Talk About Jazz Here?

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I don't see a special place for jazz discussion so I'm just asking.

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  • Kegsy
    Kegsy

    I much prefer the stuff his brother Idris did. 

  • Kegsy
    Kegsy

    I would have thought that a large percentage of the studio musicians, on most of the labels releasing soul stuff, were actually jazz musicians first and foremost, not just the Motown stable. Its

  • Addio
    Addio

    mmmmmmmmm........(very) nice

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Don't see why not. Soul music owes a debt to, and lives in the same world as jazz...and blues.....and gospel....and we used to have a reggae section but I think it died.

dean

No thank you, we don't want any talk of Herbie Mann (Memphis Underground) or the Crusaders (after all who did they work with ...apart from Bobby W, Altrina, Randy Crawford, etc), Cannonball Adderley, George Benson (Breezin), Idris Muhammad and their like on here !! 

As for all that Salsa stuff ........... stuff it. 

Edited by Roburt

One thing about the jazz world (especially in the US) ..... the fans were / are a lot more loyal.

FOR INSTANCE ............ long after Willie Tee stopped getting calls to perform his old soul numbers (except from the UK), he was kept busy working with his brother Earl Turbington on jazz club bookings (& they made some recordings together of a similar nature).  

13 minutes ago, Roburt said:

No thank you, we don't want any talk of Herbie Mann (Memphis Underground) or the Crusaders (after all who did they work with ...apart from Bobby W, Altrina, Randy Crawford, etc), Cannonball Adderley, George Benson (Breezin), Adris Muhammad and their like on here !! 

As for all that Salsa stuff ........... stuff it. 

I much prefer the stuff his brother Idris did. 

Most of the Funk Brothers moonlighted in the jazz clubs a lot of the improvisations in their music came from there.

3 minutes ago, sjclement said:

Most of the Funk Brothers moonlighted in the jazz clubs a lot of the improvisations in their music came from there.

I would have thought that a large percentage of the studio musicians, on most of the labels releasing soul stuff, were actually jazz musicians first and foremost, not just the Motown stable.

Its always been obvious to me that the "Motown" sound owes much to big band jazz.

Edited by Kegsy

There is of course the jazz / soul crossover stuff like Marlena Shaw, Clea Bradfrod, Nina Simone, Terry Callier etc.   Or the odd track that crosses over from people such as Ella Fitzgerald Buddy Rich. 

36 minutes ago, Kegsy said:

I much prefer the stuff his brother Idris did. 

Look, ain't seem our kid for ages, so I make mistakes AND ain't got no help from him or Willie Hutch .... otherwise Mart cuda been a Brother whos Gonna Work It Out before you get to add your silly comment.       BTW seen Keith's sad news on Facebook  :-(

Would be great if there was a separate section for jazz/jazz fusion. I have to confess I don't even differentiate between soul music and the likes of Bob James, Ramsey Lewis, Nancy Wilson, David Sanborn, Dave Grusin, Ralph McDonald, Morrisey Mullen, Richard Tee, Bob Baldwin.....the list goes on

 

Kev

13 hours ago, Kegsy said:

I would have thought that a large percentage of the studio musicians, on most of the labels releasing soul stuff, were actually jazz musicians first and foremost, not just the Motown stable.

Its always been obvious to me that the "Motown" sound owes much to big band jazz.

This is definitely true.  Pianists/arrangers Joe Hunter, Johnny Allen, Gil Askey were all Jazz musicians, as were ALL of Joe Hunter's band (including Mike Terry, James Jamerson, drummers Benny Benjamin, Uriel Jones and Pistol Allen, Robert White, Joe Messina, sax man Beans Bowles, guitarist Don Davis (Don Davis Trio). trombonist Herbie Williams, etc. Earl Van Dyke and Popcorn Wylie were Jazz pianists before Motown.  I would say that MOST Motown session players played Jazz.  Those few who didn't (Gordon Staples-Motown Strings) played Classical music.

There's jazz & then there's jaaaazzzzzz .... the supper club type ..... I don't like all types of jazz but I do like everything on the funky end of the genre ....

........... like this for instance ............. 

AND this lady just about always stuck to straight unadulterated mainstream jazz ..... AND ... got lots of club gigs coz of that ..... 

EstherMarrow70x.jpg

Really enjoy the jazz-soul from the 60's. People like Jimmy McGriff, Richard Groove Holmes, Fats Theus, Hank Crawford, Leon Spencer, Boogaloo Joe Jones and Reuben Wilson are top notch. Not too sure about jazz-funk, which got terribly bland as the 70's wore on.

the term 'soul' in a musical context was first aspplied to jazz anyway wasnt it? started a thread on here a while back about jazzy soul a while back, will see if i can dig it up and link.

Coltrane does it for me - although not anywhere near as keen on his more free-form/experimental works. Just love this interpretation of Mongo Santamaria's Afro Blue from the series Jazz Casual. This whole episode featuring the classic John Coltrane Quartet is fantastic!

 

Absolutely love this from British jazz musician, John Surman - 10 minutes of jazz dance pleasure! Well, wish I could dance to this sort of stuff in the style of the jazz dancers who thrived on the London scene in the 80s and 90s!

 

mmmmmmmmm........(very) nice

Edited by Addio

^^^
IMHO, I wouldn't call that "jazz" in the slightest. It's a great fusion of styles that includes elements of jazz, but it's not jazz. Far from it in my book. And I say that as someone who likes Jon Lucien very much. 

The forum is called SOUL Source - sorry but there's quite enough effing jazz and jazz forums around - it's not like its not well served on the net, I KNOW there's a lot of crossover, but (having been force fed it by my father) full-on jazz leaves me absolutely cold.

Personally I think it's pretentious twaddle (and when you get into free-form stuff I simply won't accept any argument suggesting it's anything other than self-impressed masturbatory shite) and I for one don't want to put up with chin rubbing discussions about Coltrane, Bird, Oscar Peterson or even the Crusaders.

Dx

Edited by DaveNPete

7 minutes ago, Russell Gilbert said:

^^^
IMHO, I wouldn't call that "jazz" in the slightest. It's a great fusion of styles that includes elements of jazz, but it's not jazz. Far from it in my book. And I say that as someone who likes Jon Lucien very much. 

"Jazzy" ?

Just wondered what people's opinion was on this. It appears to be Jimmy Wisner and has a bit of a "Wade in the water" feel about it. Still jazz in my book.

Kev

 

 

The above IS Jimmy Wisner, back in his Buffalo days. It was his record label too.

Another from him (but the vocals on this make it a lot more MOR) .........

 

Edited by Roburt

  • Author
1 hour ago, stateside said:

Just wondered what people's opinion was on this. It appears to be Jimmy Wisner and has a bit of a "Wade in the water" feel about it. Still jazz in my book.

Kev

 

 

Sounds like jazz to me.

On 10/03/2016 at 22:07, Gotsoul said:

I don't see a special place for jazz discussion so I'm just asking.

looks like there is now :thumbsup:

5 hours ago, Russell Gilbert said:

^^^
IMHO, I wouldn't call that "jazz" in the slightest. It's a great fusion of styles that includes elements of jazz, but it's not jazz. Far from it in my book. And I say that as someone who likes Jon Lucien very much. 

Rare Groove then?

No.  It's "all about the Soul"

Edited by Guest

I first heard this on Richard Searling's radio show and ended up writing in to the show because he didn't announce who it was. It just blew me away, fantastic vocals....my kind of jazz, but so soulful..Nice.

I bought the album on Esoteric Records............ Anyone got any background on her?

Kev

 

Edited by stateside

1 hour ago, sjclement said:

Rare Groove then?

Nah, in my book rare groove is a scene, not a genre. That said, so much music defies being labelled – usually when it's infused with different styles and cultural flavours, which is exactly the case with Jon Lucien's stuff. :thumbsup:

11 minutes ago, stateside said:

I first heard this on Richard Searling's radio show and ended up writing in to the show because he didn't announce who it was. It just blew me away, fantastic vocals....my kind of jazz, but so soulful..Nice.

I bought the album on Esoteric Records............ Anyone got any background on her?

Kev

 

......... AND ... you could pick up copies of the album in the UK back then for pence (Yanks, Mancaster I think). 

An 'Andy Whitmore' discovery if I'm not mistaken. Seem to recall Andy doing an article on Leslie in a soul fanzine back then. 

Edited by Roburt

  • Author

I've always been a fan of the great-Wes Montgomery, maybe the best jazz guitarist ever whose idol was-Charlie Christian.

23 hours ago, Russell Gilbert said:

Absolutely love this from British jazz musician, John Surman - 10 minutes of jazz dance pleasure! Well, wish I could dance to this sort of stuff in the style of the jazz dancers who thrived on the London scene in the 80s and 90s!

 

A total classic which goes mental half way through.

Love some 50ts/60ts Jazz 

Sonny Rollins Way out West onComtemporay

John Coltranes Classic take My Favourite Things on Atlantic

and anything by Charles Mingus

just brilliant 

 

 

 

Edited by phil shields

Another UK offering .......... BUT this is pure jazz funk ........ with great vocals from Carol Kenyon .........

... the guys started off (on their jazzy route) across in NY with the likes of Herbie Mann (not bad credentials) ....

 

Early Morrisey Mullen, cut in the US with the AWB ..... 1977 ....... "Burst Fender" ..........

...... back in those days they were working with the likes of LVDross, Cissy Houston, Beverly Ingram, Arnold McCuller, David Laslee, etc .... not a bad bunch ....

 

 

Edited by Roburt

Yet more Morrisey and Mullen ........ "Love Don't Live Here Johnny Moore" ..........

.... this is more of a Rolls Royce performance than a Rose Royce one.

 

Edited by Roburt

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