Over the years I have brought various people along to northern soul do's who aren't into the scene. They are always taken aback by how dominated the scene is by men, especially considering that alot of the lyrics are about 'love' or songs are tortuous and gut-wrenching, with so much emotion. One recurring question that keeps coming up is 'are they all gay?' Indeed I have been to many a soul venue where there are obviously gay couples in attendance but have tried to explain a little of the history of the scene and it's hetero, male, working class beginnings. (correct me if I'm wrong). One friend in particular is particularly interested so I told her I would post this up to see what response there is as she is keen to fine-tune her gaydar!

I don't see how the percentage would be any greater or less than on any other scene! (except of course the Gay scene... which is almost exclusively Gay... or so I'm told!).

Sean

funny you should say that my, missus says that we all look like homosexuals the way we all dance about, & that a large chunk tends to be blokes doing the dancing, after 12 yrs she still cant get her head round it silly girl

Over the years I have brought various people along to northern soul do's who aren't into the scene. They are always taken aback by how dominated the scene is by men, especially considering that alot of the lyrics are about 'love' or songs are tortuous and gut-wrenching, with so much emotion. One recurring question that keeps coming up is 'are they all gay?' Indeed I have been to many a soul venue where there are obviously gay couples in attendance but have tried to explain a little of the history of the scene and it's hetero, male, working class beginnings. (correct me if I'm wrong). One friend in particular is particularly interested so I told her I would post this up to see what response there is as she is keen to fine-tune her gaydar!

Only thing i`ll swop is me records,maybe me i`m not gay,it`s the others where Simsy he`s the S/S gay expert,ax him

Can this include bi-sexuals, tranvestites and swingers

Bearsy

Can this include bi-sexuals, tranvestites and swingers

Bearsy

I have done

HEADSEYS NAME GIVES IT AWAY.

BAZ A

I have done

Which ones have you done Ken,

can you name names or are they still hanging up

Bearsy

Which ones have you done Ken,

can you name names or are they still hanging up

Bearsy

..............

Edited November 26, 200618 yr by ken

Over the years I have brought various people along to northern soul do's who aren't into the scene. They are always taken aback by how dominated the scene is by men, especially considering that alot of the lyrics are about 'love' or songs are tortuous and gut-wrenching, with so much emotion. One recurring question that keeps coming up is 'are they all gay?' Indeed I have been to many a soul venue where there are obviously gay couples in attendance but have tried to explain a little of the history of the scene and it's hetero, male, working class beginnings. (correct me if I'm wrong). One friend in particular is particularly interested so I told her I would post this up to see what response there is as she is keen to fine-tune her gaydar!

Marisa , let me tell you, as far as the the Northern scene goes , that "all singing all dancing macho blokiness having fun together" that characterises the scene has much more to do to with the very straight music hall sing along tradition in the United Kingdom or should even just be likened to just a group of blokes having a healthy pub singalong, rather than any "gay" thing ... "not that there's anything wrong with that", as Seinfeld would say ...

Of course there's always been a gay element in the soul scene, as there always has been in any section or group of our society, but really at the end of the day it's always been a MINOR element .

Had an interesting discussion recently with some people about the origins of the Disco scene in the US and the way that it's been documented in various music history books. The gay element in the Disco scene has always been strongly emphasised, with its origins often claimed to emanate from the bath house culture and loft parties in New York in the late 60s early 70s. But really, that gay-centric, New York-centric perspective of the origins of Disco, is not really accurate at all and has been unduly over-emphasised, if anything.

The real driving and creative force behind the development of Disco in every aspect (ie music clothes culture clubs etc), was in fact black heterosexual teens . For evidence of that one only only needs to read the chapter on "Dances" in Robert Pruter's brilliant book "Chicago Soul". That and the emergence of the Soul Train program on US TV screens in 1971 proved to be crucial in the development of disco and dance music in the 70's. This slightly politically incorrect view may raise a whole new issue for debate here but your comments and posts are encouraged !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Edited November 26, 200618 yr by sunnysoul

I'm sorry to ask, but are you serious???

...Who cares, who shags who.

Just tell your mates that because the songs are mainly about love, they'd rather not look at that woman they see every day . Besides, if the music moved them and they met some nice people on the scene, they would not care about statistics unrelated to vinyl or artists.

m

this is a bloody stupid question with no relevance whatso-fuckin-ever ....

does it matter ? who gives a bollox

maybe i'm being a bit spiritual but it is the same as the female dj thing , if a soul fan is male , female , black , white , yellow ,gay , straight , both , english , scottish , even welsh it DOES NOT HAVE ANY RELEVANCE

this is a bloody stupid question with no relevance whatso-fuckin-ever ....

does it matter ? who gives a bollox

, even welsh it DOES NOT HAVE ANY RELEVANCE

TBH I think I am Gay!.

I often get the feeling I am a Lesbian trapped inside a mans body!.

this is a bloody stupid question with no relevance whatso-fuckin-ever ....

does it matter ? who gives a bollox

, even welsh it DOES NOT HAVE ANY RELEVANCE

you are not serious with that little angry face are you?

David Henry Llewelyn Hudson

i dont think im gay ...but then ive never tried it so who can say .....

ive often danced in GAY abandon tho does that count????

cookie

TBH I think I am Gay!.

I often get the feeling I am a Lesbian trapped inside a mans body!.

dont you think you should change your user name to JARPOT instead then

Bearsy

Over the years I have brought various people along to northern soul do's who aren't into the scene. They are always taken aback by how dominated the scene is by men, especially considering that alot of the lyrics are about 'love' or songs are tortuous and gut-wrenching, with so much emotion. One recurring question that keeps coming up is 'are they all gay?' Indeed I have been to many a soul venue where there are obviously gay couples in attendance but have tried to explain a little of the history of the scene and it's hetero, male, working class beginnings. (correct me if I'm wrong). One friend in particular is particularly interested so I told her I would post this up to see what response there is as she is keen to fine-tune her gaydar!

=================

Maybe you should give a recurring answer............pi should do the trick

well I know for a FACT

IM NOT GAY

but my boyfriend is

Marisa , let me tell you, as far as the the Northern scene goes , that "all singing all dancing macho blokiness having fun together" that characterises the scene has much more to do to with the very straight music hall sing along tradition in the United Kingdom or should even just be likened to just a group of blokes having a healthy pub singalong, rather than any "gay" thing ... "not that there's anything wrong with that", as Seinfeld would say ...

Of course there's always been a gay element in the soul scene, as there always has been in any section or group of our society, but really at the end of the day it's always been a MINOR element .

Had an interesting discussion recently with some people about the origins of the Disco scene in the US and the way that it's been documented in various music history books. The gay element in the Disco scene has always been strongly emphasised, with its origins often claimed to emanate from the bath house culture and loft parties in New York in the late 60s early 70s. But really, that gay-centric, New York-centric perspective of the origins of Disco, is not really accurate at all and has been unduly over-emphasised, if anything.

The real driving and creative force behind the development of Disco in every aspect (ie music clothes culture clubs etc), was in fact black heterosexual teens . For evidence of that one only only needs to read the chapter on "Dances" in Robert Pruter's brilliant book "Chicago Soul". That and the emergence of the Soul Train program on US TV screens in 1971 proved to be crucial in the development of disco and dance music in the 70's. This slightly politically incorrect view may raise a whole new issue for debate here but your comments and posts are encouraged !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm always on the lookout for a good read especially leading up to Xmas so i'll try and get hold of the book 'Chicagi Soul'.

Thanks for your contribution to good, healthy discussion, which, after all is what I thought forums were about.

I've met many fab people on the scene over the years both gay and straight!

Only thing i`ll swop is me records,maybe me i`m not gay,it`s the others where Simsy he`s the S/S gay expert,ax him

Yea Come on SIMSY, Where's your input ? ? ? ?

Bucky

I'm always on the lookout for a good read especially leading up to Xmas so i'll try and get hold of the book 'Chicagi Soul'.

Thanks for your contribution to good, healthy discussion, which, after all is what I thought forums were about.

I've met many fab people on the scene over the years both gay and straight!

============

I've met many who were grey and in a state

============

I've met many who were grey and in a state

Not suprised to see posts from Maria and George, both having grown up in one of the biggest gay cities of the world therefore making sexual politics a non issue.

BTW There has been a strong affinity within drag queen culture and soul music since the days of Stonewall.

Seriously though, first it was gender based threads now sexuality based ones.... are people just clutching at straws for topics????

Yea Come on SIMSY, Where's your input ? ? ? ?

Bucky

As a serving member of the Royal Navy I would just like to add that women are ok if you cant get the real thing !!! gotta dash its my turn in the barrel .

Do you not also think there may be an element with women/girls who are not completely on the soul scene that cos we really arnt interested that much in chicks when we're talking/dancing to soul music they get the hump, especially if they are used to getting pestered up down the local trapping joint. Nothing like watching attractive girls/women dance but paranoia & small penis syndrome as well as the tendancy not to stop talking bollox once started are not traits non soul women find attractive in their men.

BTW what percentage of women on the soul scene are lesbians ??? I dont mean those ones in comfortable shoes I mean those real ones that you see in the magazines .

Russ

As a serving member of the Royal Navy I would just like to add that women are ok if you cant get the real thing !!! gotta dash its my turn in the barrel .

Do you not also think there may be an element with women/girls who are not completely on the soul scene that cos we really arnt interested that much in chicks when we're talking/dancing to soul music they get the hump, especially if they are used to getting pestered up down the local trapping joint. Nothing like watching attractive girls/women dance but paranoia & small penis syndrome as well as the tendancy not to stop talking bollox once started are not traits non soul women find attractive in their men.

BTW what percentage of women on the soul scene are lesbians ??? I dont mean those ones in comfortable shoes I mean those real ones that you see in the magazines .

Russ

=====

we went to a gay fireworks nite the other week

all the fireworks went off with a puff!

sorry

I think this question is just a bleeding pain in the arse ----- oh, er, hang on I didn't mean, oh bolloxs! LOL

Edited November 27, 200618 yr by TheBigO

where Simsy he`s the S/S gay expert,ax him

Yea Come on SIMSY, Where's your input ? ? ? ?

Bucky

I think you boys are bi-curious.

Sadly I can't help you.. But I know a man who can..

=====

we went to a gay fireworks nite the other week

all the fireworks went off with a puff!

sorry

Maybe its because its Monday but that is funny. I once saw a gay friend fall over a small stool in a pub, a poof falling over a pouffe. My how we laughed. All of us.

Erm, does it matter who is gay? My mate reckons that your average soul night looks like a football firm's retirement party, not a night in Heaven, we're all too ugly to be gay.

Marvin`s Gay(e)

It does not matter really anyone can come on the scene we don't care as long as they enjoy it. only 2 things though

1. if your gay and try chatting me up i will be off before you can goodbye, i am not gay and to be chatted up by one would make me not happy

2. if you see a girl you chat to and she says i am a lesbian it makes me think oh man my plan has gone up the duff

Who me dear gay dear no dear....

I think there's a lot of truth in this...I've always threatened to do an article about how big the influence of Gay men has been on the Northern Soul scene. It's hardly the butchest music in the world...all those strings, the emotion, the tempo, the drama...oh hang on thats High Energy.

All together now...

'A touch of V ( *) enus is a wonderful moment..... there's nothing worse than being a clone...excuse me while I kiss this guy.....he's all I got...' 'You Didn't Say A Word Is' socamp it's untrue... and as for those whoops in tracks like The Velvets 'I Got To Find Me Somebody'. Of course, this is only a problem if you think Gay, or even camp, is a bad thing...

All together now...boopity boop boop.....can't help loving that man of miiiiiiiine....

Maybe its because its Monday but that is funny. I once saw a gay friend fall over a small stool in a pub, a poof falling over a pouffe. My how we laughed. All of us.

Well Stuart, I hope whoever was responsible for the small stool eventually cleaned it up, and vowed to keep his dog under control!

I don't really think it's appropriate to question ones sexuality on the soul scene, let alone in general. We are now in the millenium, and with the fact that homosexuality/bisexuality has been brought out in the open and, therefore, more widely accepted, I believe that every music scene has a gay element, same as it does a mixed race element.

After all, isn't the soul scene all about the music? Should diversity be brought into it?

Yours,

Gene (straight, married, and doesn't give a monkeys!)

Edited November 27, 200618 yr by Gene-R

well I know for a FACT

IM NOT GAY

but my boyfriend is

Fantastic quote

It does not matter really anyone can come on the scene we don't care as long as they enjoy it. only 2 things though

1. if your gay and try chatting me up i will be off before you can goodbye, i am not gay and to be chatted up by one would make me not happy

2. if you see a girl you chat to and she says i am a lesbian it makes me think oh man my plan has gone up the duff

I hope one day your real identity is uncovered!!

I hope one day your real identity is uncovered!!

I think it might be Graham Taylor, the ex footie manager.

Sorry.

Who me dear gay dear no dear....

I think there's a lot of truth in this...I've always threatened to do an article about how big the influence of Gay men has been on the Northern Soul scene. It's hardly the butchest music in the world...all those strings, the emotion, the tempo, the drama...oh hang on thats High Energy.

All together now...

'A touch of V ( *) enus is a wonderful moment..... there's nothing worse than being a clone...excuse me while I kiss this guy.....he's all I got...' 'You Didn't Say A Word Is' socamp it's untrue... and as for those whoops in tracks like The Velvets 'I Got To Find Me Somebody'. Of course, this is only a problem if you think Gay, or even camp, is a bad thing...

All together now...boopity boop boop.....can't help loving that man of miiiiiiiine....

My brother does a wonderfully camp Drag Queen impression to 'Kiss my love goodbye'. One that would look great in Prescilla Queen of the Desert.

Northern Soul helped this small town boy have a more enlightened attitude towards gay and black men especially. Lezzer's are less visible on the scene, but I obviously know one or two. I guess it is because at all nighters these guys could and can be themselves without some local heroic neanderthal wanting to bash them cos they are queer or a different colour. Its one of the sides to the northern soul scene that we can really be proud of.

Edited November 27, 200618 yr by in town Mikey

My take on this is that men have trouble expressing emotions and feelings. Football may be an outlet for venting those such as anger,frustration etc whilst the music appeals to that softer side that we don't like to admit we have.

As for working class roots/attitudes etc I think we get an extremely biased press. I'd agree NS is a working class phenomena but from the beginning there was an atmosphere of tolerance and friendliness. I've witnessed more trouble down the pub or student disco over a weekend than I have attending various venues over the past 38 years.

Similarly those middle-class orgies of self-congragulation such as Rock against Racism or Live Aid for Africa where hardly a black face is to be seen out of the context of "victim" make me cringe.

We may not have caught on to the PC jargon but we all live together and in the main get on with those of different faiths,colours and sexuality cos a bit of respect and politeness cost us nothing.

The idea that the working class is some kinda unintelligent mob to be mobilised en masse against minorities of any kind is a fallacy put about by

the Media who are predominantly middle class and only condescend to pay any attention when there are flare-ups, which IMO is down to social/economic conditions and not cos we're a bunch of racist homophobes.

ROD

Edited November 27, 200618 yr by modernsoulsucks

Who me dear gay dear no dear....

I think there's a lot of truth in this...I've always threatened to do an article about how big the influence of Gay men has been on the Northern Soul scene. It's hardly the butchest music in the world...all those strings, the emotion, the tempo, the drama...oh hang on thats High Energy.

All together now...

'A touch of V ( *) enus is a wonderful moment..... there's nothing worse than being a clone...excuse me while I kiss this guy.....he's all I got...' 'You Didn't Say A Word Is' socamp it's untrue... and as for those whoops in tracks like The Velvets 'I Got To Find Me Somebody'. Of course, this is only a problem if you think Gay, or even camp, is a bad thing...

All together now...boopity boop boop.....can't help loving that man of miiiiiiiine....

OUCH! That hit home Simon! Good post.

Theyre easy to spot, they usually wear biker leathers and their favourite d.j. is Butch.

and their favourite d.j. is Butch.

My take on this is that men have trouble expressing emotions and feelings. Football may be an outlet for venting those such as anger,frustration etc whilst the music appeals to that softer side that we don't like to admit we have.

As for working class roots/attitudes etc I think we get an extremely biased press. I'd agree NS is a working class phenomena but from the beginning there was an atmosphere of tolerance and friendliness. I've witnessed more trouble down the pub or student disco over a weekend than I have attending various venues over the past 38 years.

Similarly those middle-class orgies of self-congragulation such as Rock against Racism or Live Aid for Africa where hardly a black face is to be seen out of the context of "victim" make me cringe.

We may not have caught on to the PC jargon but we all live together and in the main get on with those of different faiths,colours and sexuality cos a bit of respect and politeness cost us nothing.

The idea that the working class is some kinda unintelligent mob to be mobilised en masse against minorities of any kind is a fallacy put about by

the Media who are predominantly middle class and only condescend to pay any attention when there are flare-ups, which IMO is down to social/economic conditions and not cos we're a bunch of racist homophobes.

ROD

You have a point there.......... But I think it's much better to got to a football match and vent one's frustrations there than in a say, one on one road rage incident. In fact, there's nothing better than an afternoon up the Cobblers ( ) shouting yer head off at someone else's inadequacies, whether the ref or players. Win or lose, I look forward to a complete contrast of un-macho ness at a soul night.

Theyre easy to spot, they usually wear biker leathers ........

===========

I know it's not PC to laugh at the above, but I couldn't help myself. It sort of fitted in with Marisa's friend hoping to improve her gaydar. Marisa exactly why does she want to improve her gaydar anyway??

I don't think it's un PC just not very accurate ! Ian Levine in biker leathers....no. It's wrong just plain wrong. Did you know one of the current fashionable Gay looks was those brightly coloured workmen Hi Vis things and boots? It's hilarious.

YMCA it's fun at the YMCA go west go west a touch of penis oh my god walk like a man, don't pity me, high drama of the first order.

don't know what the fuss is all about, does'nt matter does it.BTW have you seen the photos of the Attic nite on the front page? WHAT LOVELY CURTAINS , WONDER WHERE THE FABRIC'S FROM?

I don't think it's un PC just not very accurate ! Ian Levine in biker leathers....no. It's wrong just plain wrong. Did you know one of the current fashionable Gay looks was those brightly coloured workmen Hi Vis things and boots? It's hilarious.

YMCA it's fun at the YMCA go west go west a touch of penis oh my god walk like a man, don't pity me, high drama of the first order.

=============

The inaccuracy was what made me laugh, and what a fantastic answer to such a strange question. Give people stereotypes, it makes them feel so much safer

I had no idea about the latest gay fashion statement, but my postman has just come to my door in a high visibility jacket, which has left me wondering......................

What percentage of postmen are gay?

What percentage of postmen are gay?

Proberly got about as much relativity as this thread

Proberly got about as much relativity as this thread

===========

Yep, exactly the point

Maybe its because its Monday but that is funny. I once saw a gay friend fall over a small stool in a pub, a poof falling over a pouffe. My how we laughed. All of us.

You need to worry if you are sat at the bar and he offers to push your stool in...

=============

The inaccuracy was what made me laugh, and what a fantastic answer to such a strange question. Give people stereotypes, it makes them feel so much safer

I had no idea about the latest gay fashion statement, but my postman has just come to my door in a high visibility jacket, which has left me wondering......................

What percentage of postmen are gay?

Just a silly answer to a ridiculous question really.Isnt it funny that this type of enquiry always seems to come from `freinds`?

Sorry Winnie,being PC was never my forte but how do know I`m not gay?

Just a silly answer to a ridiculous question really.Isnt it funny that this type of enquiry always seems to come from `freinds`?

Sorry Winnie,being PC was never my forte but how do know I`m not gay?

==========

Never meant you weren't PC, was saying I wasn't PC for laughing out loud at it But as you say, it was the madness of the question that would have made what you said such an good answer. ie: answer the question with what the questioner would like to hear

I have no idea about your sexual orientation, it has no relevance to me, but I do have a friend who'd like to know if you ever wear high visibility jackets