Steve G Posted April 27, 2005 Share Posted April 27, 2005 Didn't see tonight's closing prices - what did Tobi Legend go for in the end? Nick link Think it was something like 595 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 But he has done a few things wrong in my book..like selling that cottonpickin` price guide to the Americans..and ruining it for us over here...Would we have all these attempted scams by Americans on eBay for records that don`t exist otherwise? No of course not..We`d still be buying records from the States (like my avatar) for next to nothing instead of for thousands.....Our buddies from the States are ready for us now...... link HI, new to this forum and one of those "buddies" who used to get screwed regular at shows in Emeryville (California) by the likes of you, I'm sure. Sold a Troy Dodds on El camino for $4- didn't even tape it, don't remember what it sounded like except it didn't move me- And besides, the secret was out well before Manship- Soussan "wrote" a piece of crap in the early 90's that made me take another look through my collection, I can assure you. And once eBay happened, you couldn't've kept it in the dark anyway... I've always been amazed at you UKers who prefer the old days when you got ripped off by your countrymen who flew over here and brought back the records to the story today when you 'takes your chance' with everyone else on the internet. My gripe with the guides has to do with the fact that the Northern money mania has pushed virtually everything else soul aside. No bidders for great! harmony and deep soul or even the stuff Manship calls R&B in his new guide. If it's not Northern it's not bought, and because it's not bought it's not offered. Pray tell me why a record like 'Goodbye Cruel Love', which is offered at least once a month on eBay continues to sell for $200 and up, while something like 'You've Got Me On A String' by the Freeman Bros. got NO bids at $50? I was, and am still, a bit more into deep soul and group harmony than Northern, but have very little luck with that stuff on eBay, either buying it or selling it, because the Japanese seem to have disappeared, and let's face it, my fellow Americans still seem to think $20 is a hell of a lot of money to pay for a soul record. That said, has anyone looked at Tim Brown's book? Any more realistic? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Steve G Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 link Rhythmdog, There has never been much of a UK market for deep / sweet / harmony - even back in the day, most of that stuff got sold to Japan, where there wasn't really the "club" / dance influence. There are some of us who buy it avidly, but not many. Tim Brown's book has some glaring errors in it, mainly around 70's, but that just proves the point that there are no fixed prices for some things, and nobody knows everything about the scene. Mentioning Tim he made a very good comment in the latest Manifesto about the scene "eating itself" meaning that many good northern records also don't sell, and more and more people are simply chasing "trophy" records at this point. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Dan Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 I've always been amazed at you UKers who prefer the old days when you got ripped off by your countrymen who flew over here and brought back the records to the story today when you 'takes your chance' with everyone else on the internet. hi rhythmdog welcome to soul-source you guys were robbed blind by us for decades so a little payback is fair enough i suppose manship guide has been good in that it has winkled records out that were never going to see the light of day but it's at best a double-edged sword IMO now you get things like the mirettes he's alright with me being listed as 'super rare northern soul' with a $49.99 opening bid (never mind the total chancers listing doo-wop, 50s rock and roll and modern jazz as 'northern soul' in the hope that we really are that stupid!) i for one don't think we were 'ripped off' by our countrymen, particularly prices were lower before the guide and when you factor in the cost of going to the states and the time spent hunting stuff down it never, or at least rarely, felt like paying too much; the long-time stability of the market over here is testament to that, surely plus a lot of people, not just the major dealers, spent their own time over there and still do and manship made it harder to pick up bargains (though it can still be done) re deep soul etc, not much demand for it over here - there are fans but out-and-out ballads, however soulful, leave me personally cold anyway, glad to see you aboard - try selling things on here rather than ebay for a while! cheers dan Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 hi rhythmdog welcome to soul-source you guys were robbed blind by us for decades so a little payback is fair enough i suppose manship guide has been good in that it has winkled records out that were never going to see the light of day but it's at best a double-edged sword IMO now you get things like the mirettes he's alright with me being listed as 'super rare northern soul' with a $49.99 opening bid (never mind the total chancers listing doo-wop, 50s rock and roll and modern jazz as 'northern soul' in the hope that we really are that stupid!) i for one don't think we were 'ripped off' by our countrymen, particularly prices were lower before the guide and when you factor in the cost of going to the states and the time spent hunting stuff down it never, or at least rarely, felt like paying too much; the long-time stability of the market over here is testament to that, surely plus a lot of people, not just the major dealers, spent their own time over there and still do and manship made it harder to pick up bargains (though it can still be done) re deep soul etc, not much demand for it over here - there are fans but out-and-out ballads, however soulful, leave me personally cold anyway, glad to see you aboard - try selling things on here rather than ebay for a while! cheers dan link Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 8, 2005 Share Posted May 8, 2005 link I just might do, that is, try some out onboard. It wasn't my main point... As to the rip-off part, it's a question of who is sucking down the main part of the profit. If a dealer bought my Troy Dodds for $4 and sold it over there for 350 (being back then, not now), I wasn't in the loop. Did I get "ripped off"? Not really, because as I say, the record didn't do much for me. The fact that others went for it in a big way is none of my biz if I can't be bothered to learn. If a bunch of soulies competed with each other to buy that one copy, then no one got ripped off. On the other hand, what about the dealer (many of them) who came over here, bought a 100-count and then cleverly listed it as rare on auction and took on all "winners". That rip is a ripoff. Does it really matter if the one doing the rip is from your green & pleasant land? You may think so, because his greater familiarity with the scene allows him to pretend to some passion for the same records that move you, but scratch deep and most dealers are motivated by the moolah, not the sound. "Winkled out"- yes, that's the point. Northern that hasn't seen the light for many years shows up because of the $. Deep/Low Rider/Group harmony, not so much, because no one is eating the winkles... I really don't think it's Manship who has killed the bargains for you guys who actually come over here and look. I think it's eBay. Virtually any record dealer over here who has 60's/70's to sell must have, by now, given eBay a try. And been pleased to get some big bids for what to US ears may sound over-produced and lacking in intensity, often. I'm not talking about me- I followed Motown and the Scepter/Wand stuff into soul, so I go for the big production, myself. Anyway, I'm starved for actual info about rekkids. The passion is there, it's just that it's not necessarily passion for the exact same sounds! So, thanks for welcoming me aboard Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Brian Ellis Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 Did anyone notice what Joseph Moore - I still can't get to you - Marvlus finally made? Thanks Brian Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ted Massey Posted June 7, 2005 Author Share Posted June 7, 2005 Did anyone notice what Joseph Moore - I still can't get to you - Marvlus finally made? Thanks Brian link About £1300 i think Ted Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
MarkWhiteley Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 now that is one WAY overpriced 45 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
davidwapples Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 funny how it made just under guide price isnt it whats the normal value of it Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Steve G Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 now that is one WAY overpriced 45 link Great Record though! My old vg+ copy has seen many years good service Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
MarkWhiteley Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Great Record though! My old vg+ copy has seen many years good service link naah I don't like it..... Very average imo... yet another one that no-one would be bothered about if it was worth £20 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ernie Andrews Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 I just might do, that is, try some out onboard. It wasn't my main point... As to the rip-off part, it's a question of who is sucking down the main part of the profit. If a dealer bought my Troy Dodds for $4 and sold it over there for 350 (being back then, not now), I wasn't in the loop. Did I get "ripped off"? Not really, because as I say, the record didn't do much for me. The fact that others went for it in a big way is none of my biz if I can't be bothered to learn. If a bunch of soulies competed with each other to buy that one copy, then no one got ripped off. On the other hand, what about the dealer (many of them) who came over here, bought a 100-count and then cleverly listed it as rare on auction and took on all "winners". That rip is a ripoff. Does it really matter if the one doing the rip is from your green & pleasant land? You may think so, because his greater familiarity with the scene allows him to pretend to some passion for the same records that move you, but scratch deep and most dealers are motivated by the moolah, not the sound. "Winkled out"- yes, that's the point. Northern that hasn't seen the light for many years shows up because of the $. Deep/Low Rider/Group harmony, not so much, because no one is eating the winkles... I really don't think it's Manship who has killed the bargains for you guys who actually come over here and look. I think it's eBay. Virtually any record dealer over here who has 60's/70's to sell must have, by now, given eBay a try. And been pleased to get some big bids for what to US ears may sound over-produced and lacking in intensity, often. I'm not talking about me- I followed Motown and the Scepter/Wand stuff into soul, so I go for the big production, myself. Anyway, I'm starved for actual info about rekkids. The passion is there, it's just that it's not necessarily passion for the exact same sounds! So, thanks for welcoming me aboard link I have to admit that most of what is being said her is actually very relevant. As I have said in other threads thre price guides have really not helped us not so rich people pick up very much on our infrequent trips to the states. But their is a very good point here about the dealers in the UK pushing prices up and soemtimes you cannot blame them as they have chosen it as their buisness whereas we (Myself) its my recreation and not my livelihood. The main concern for me now is the easy repressing of records by unsrcupulous people in the States and passing them off as originals (Frederick Hymes would be a good example). The particular person involved in selling copies of this record with alarming regularity also admitted to me that he had supplied the main dealers in the uk but none of these dealers have questioned the authenticity of the discs in terms of age and that in my view decreases their credibility to the point of who can you trust if you cannot trust supposedly well established dealers in the uk. Taking the Frederick hymes as the exanple- I have what I think is an original and the reason is I took the vynil to an expert in the oil industry here(IN Aberdeen) who works in the lab section of a big company and they confirmed through testing that this was a over 25 years old. I then passed another record which was made recently and they confirmed that this was less than 5 years old by their tests. The point I am making is that the copies coming from the US via ebay and according to the us source, reputable dealers are suspect in that thecopies they have circulated would not pass the tests for age of vinyl. - Thats the scientific approach- having seen other copies just to feel them they are thin vinyl and sharp at the end- the print defintion is poor compared to the originals. So I ask if these are represses then why has My Manchips guide for the original of this record been reduce from £1000.00 to £200 in his latest guide. WHo can you trust? this is my question Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Steve G Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 naah I don't like it..... Very average imo... yet another one that no-one would be bothered about if it was worth £20 link Great 60's soul, and there is a big difference between 60's and Northern at times Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Chalky Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Did anyone notice what Joseph Moore - I still can't get to you - Marvlus finally made? Thanks Brian link About £1300 i think Ted link now that is one WAY overpriced 45 link Overpriced £1000 of anyones money and considering some of the records that have been sold through JM and the prices it's cheap IMO. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest martyn Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 I just might do, that is, try some out onboard. It wasn't my main point... As to the rip-off part, it's a question of who is sucking down the main part of the profit. If a dealer bought my Troy Dodds for $4 and sold it over there for 350 (being back then, not now), I wasn't in the loop. Did I get "ripped off"? Not really, because as I say, the record didn't do much for me. The fact that others went for it in a big way is none of my biz if I can't be bothered to learn. If a bunch of soulies competed with each other to buy that one copy, then no one got ripped off. On the other hand, what about the dealer (many of them) who came over here, bought a 100-count and then cleverly listed it as rare on auction and took on all "winners". That rip is a ripoff. Does it really matter if the one doing the rip is from your green & pleasant land? You may think so, because his greater familiarity with the scene allows him to pretend to some passion for the same records that move you, but scratch deep and most dealers are motivated by the moolah, not the sound. "Winkled out"- yes, that's the point. Northern that hasn't seen the light for many years shows up because of the $. Deep/Low Rider/Group harmony, not so much, because no one is eating the winkles... I really don't think it's Manship who has killed the bargains for you guys who actually come over here and look. I think it's eBay. Virtually any record dealer over here who has 60's/70's to sell must have, by now, given eBay a try. And been pleased to get some big bids for what to US ears may sound over-produced and lacking in intensity, often. I'm not talking about me- I followed Motown and the Scepter/Wand stuff into soul, so I go for the big production, myself. Anyway, I'm starved for actual info about rekkids. The passion is there, it's just that it's not necessarily passion for the exact same sounds! So, thanks for welcoming me aboard link Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest martyn Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 I just might do, that is, try some out onboard. It wasn't my main point... As to the rip-off part, it's a question of who is sucking down the main part of the profit. If a dealer bought my Troy Dodds for $4 and sold it over there for 350 (being back then, not now), I wasn't in the loop. Did I get "ripped off"? Not really, because as I say, the record didn't do much for me. The fact that others went for it in a big way is none of my biz if I can't be bothered to learn. If a bunch of soulies competed with each other to buy that one copy, then no one got ripped off. On the other hand, what about the dealer (many of them) who came over here, bought a 100-count and then cleverly listed it as rare on auction and took on all "winners". That rip is a ripoff. Does it really matter if the one doing the rip is from your green & pleasant land? You may think so, because his greater familiarity with the scene allows him to pretend to some passion for the same records that move you, but scratch deep and most dealers are motivated by the moolah, not the sound. "Winkled out"- yes, that's the point. Northern that hasn't seen the light for many years shows up because of the $. Deep/Low Rider/Group harmony, not so much, because no one is eating the winkles... I really don't think it's Manship who has killed the bargains for you guys who actually come over here and look. I think it's eBay. Virtually any record dealer over here who has 60's/70's to sell must have, by now, given eBay a try. And been pleased to get some big bids for what to US ears may sound over-produced and lacking in intensity, often. I'm not talking about me- I followed Motown and the Scepter/Wand stuff into soul, so I go for the big production, myself. Anyway, I'm starved for actual info about rekkids. The passion is there, it's just that it's not necessarily passion for the exact same sounds! So, thanks for welcoming me aboard link Fair post Glad to hear that "no one is eating the winkles" .I will sleep soundly tonight Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Awake 502 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Any one know what Eddie Parker and Bill Brandon ended up going for ? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Simon T Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Any one know what Eddie Parker 4316 and Bill Brandon ended up going for ? 559 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Awake 502 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Flippin eck..... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ted Massey Posted June 8, 2005 Author Share Posted June 8, 2005 Flippin eck..... link JOHN GARY WILLIAMS Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Awake 502 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 JOHN GARY WILLIAMS link not half.... just thinking of that 25 count box of Bill Brandon I had many years ago.... sigh..... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
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