Hi all,

Anyone know if the rumours of a Guitar Ray find are true? Seems to be one - two for sale in top condition a week now across ebay, diacogs and the main dealer sites. My understanding was it was never that rare a record but has a stash been found Stateside?

Amazingly it seems to be rising in price!

Thanks

Edited June 11, 20222 yr by Corbett80

Bought mine off John Manship for £3.

It was not that rare back then, and I wouldn't be surprised if a small box full has turned up. 

It was only a soul collectors record when I bought it. In other words, it was good but considered to slow to DJ with! The dance floor scene has slowed down, hence the popularity of the crossover record. I don't think it's a good or bad thing that the scene has changed, it just makes it more interesting. We couldn't keep taking that dancing stimulant forever😉.

Edited June 11, 20222 yr by Solidsoul

It got played a lot ten years ago but seemed to have passed its peak. Mind you there are loads collecting now who weren't back then. Seems every town has a Johnny come lately with loads of cash and zero Imagination that just wants boxes full of known rare soul to fill the floor. Hence the demand for what should be a dead record. 

Some have definitely turned up. At least 25 but a mate reckons i to three figures.  ebay sellers  feeding them out, they were at Austin for $800 as well. 

I think it's fair to say that most people who trawled ebay and other sites before Katrina noticed a considerable down turn in the number of quality titles being up for sale or auction from New Orleans , with several of the regular sellers just dissapering or offering up water damaged titles. With so many folks living in single story shotgun houses with 80% flooding of the whole state it was no surprise. Then in 2022 I notice even more copies for sale or auction than I did prior to katrina! how convienient that one of the most well known crossover records that fetches money from New Orleans is reported to have turned up. Whilst not impossible imo it is more likely that folks are getting fooled by something more sinister or it's a minor miracle. Given that this title had been imported in reasonable quantity in the past then a load more have turned up, how ever many did the Senator press?   

What i can’t get my head round is how the price is consistently hitting the highest it has ever been when it’s obvious there are loads about? £1.2-1.5 with rumour one also recently sold for £2.2k!!! What’s going on there??

Edited June 12, 20222 yr by Corbett80

A small box of guitar ray was found in the New Orleans area some ex juke box some nm .25 count at the most .Considering that it was a minor hit in New Orleans this is probably the only area it has ever turned up.The chances of more turning up are unlikely as i am sure we are all aware of what Katrina did to a large part of the city .It is nothing more sinister

11 hours ago, Richard Free said:

A small box of guitar ray was found in the New Orleans area some ex juke box some nm .25 count at the most .Considering that it was a minor hit in New Orleans this is probably the only area it has ever turned up.The chances of more turning up are unlikely as i am sure we are all aware of what Katrina did to a large part of the city .It is nothing more sinister

Given what has trickled out on ebay and what was in the hands of sellers at Austin etc a mate reckons there was more than 25.  Regardless it doesn't appear to be affecting the price as buyers don't seem to care for some reason.  The avarice mentioned in another topic of buyers and sellers.

For the sake of transparency, the copy that I sold on ebay on June 8 came out of an extensive blues collection here in Sweden that recently was sold via a local auction house. It did not come from a recent find/stash.

Everyone's making the assumption that these Guitar Ray's where found in New Orleans, Senator Jones was a old school record producer (occasional artist although he couldn't sing,  well not that well) who knew how to hustle he had his fingers in many pies i.e, contacts throughout the south and beyond. It's not uncommon for a record to get airplay or go big far away from it's generic town. Therefore Senator could have sent a 100 count box to a promo guy any where in the states. If the Austin fair was awash with them well that's only down the road from N.O on that southern chitlin circuit. The problem is the buyers, common sense and latter day collector/DJ's are two things i wouldn't use in the same sentence, the optimum word is 'patience' if theirs a quantity then just sit back and wait, if the sellers can't sell them the price will drop. Guitar Ray was never a rare record in the first place and has made more comebacks then George Best, Firstly going big at Stafford then the later crossover scene of the late 80's into the 90's, Dj's why spend a fortune to rediscover the wheel ? 

Dave.

 

The Austin fair certainly was not awash with them .Simply one dealer had found some old ex juke box vendor stock in the New Orleans area .I suspect more than anything the outrageous price Guitar Ray is selling for at the moment is bringing other copies out and people are cashing in while the price is high .Guitar Ray is not the only “not rare” record that sells for eye watering sums .
 

3 hours ago, Richard Free said:

The Austin fair certainly was not awash with them .Simply one dealer had found some old ex juke box vendor stock in the New Orleans area .I suspect more than anything the outrageous price Guitar Ray is selling for at the moment is bringing other copies out and people are cashing in while the price is high .Guitar Ray is not the only “not rare” record that sells for eye watering sums .
 

I agree Richard. I’m struggling to remember if I even saw a copy. The current  action on this record reflects several sellers parting with their copies rather than a hoard coming to market. On the subject of the Austin Record Convention, there was relatively little there in the way of decent Northern Soul and the few choice 45’s were priced sky-high to reflect recent auction valuations: only one dealer had top rarities but at eye-watering prices, another had a box of scarce collectables at unrealistic prices, whilst a couple of dealers had the odd item or two that could be sourced on eBay with a bit of patience. The highlight of the Austin Show was catching up with the collectors from the UK.

On 12/06/2022 at 21:31, Corbett80 said:

What i can’t get my head round is how the price is consistently hitting the highest it has ever been when it’s obvious there are loads about? £1.2-1.5 with rumour one also recently sold for £2.2k!!! What’s going on there??

Hi Joel. Yet again, Northern Soul defies the laws of supply and demand. What did that geezer Adam Smith know? As DJ’s give certain records more spins, demand is stimulated as the unaware become clued in. Hotbox DJ’s then have to have the record to meet dance-floor demand. Panic buying sets in as collectors fear missing out...FMO I think you youngsters call it. Bidders chasing a record in diminishing numbers then up their bids to secure ‘their copy’ and avoid future bidding wars. As you rightly said at the start of the thread, there are more copies of this record coming to market, but no single identifiable dealer seems to be the reason for this.

I dont know what people are flapping about,unless the quantity found is the same as Danny Moore of which i very much doubt then they will disappear. Take the Four Tracks,people on here said they would not touch them with a barge pole when they were £250 each,try getting one for that now.I bought a Cautions-No other way in mint condition for £600 when that small quantity turned up,you could add another £1k to that now.

 

 

I don't know what they are flapping about for either, if this is the highlight of Djs sets then they need to take a good look at themselves.  It's a played out hammered to death oldie. No wonder the scene is stale and getting boring.

5 hours ago, Chalky said:

I don't know what they are flapping about for either, if this is the highlight of Djs sets then they need to take a good look at themselves.  It's a played out hammered to death oldie. No wonder the scene is stale and getting boring.

Nice happy post!!

 Start your own venue and play the music you like! Build up a following and something positive may come out of it!

 

 

Edited June 14, 20222 yr by Solidsoul

4 hours ago, Chalky said:

I don't know what they are flapping about for either, if this is the highlight of Djs sets then they need to take a good look at themselves.  It's a played out hammered to death oldie. No wonder the scene is stale and getting boring.

Joel was just asking a question about a potential find of a record  - nothing more, nothing less and no flapping involved 

2 hours ago, girdwoodinc said:

Joel was just asking a question about a potential find of a record  - nothing more, nothing less and no flapping involved 

and he got his answer

Typed an answer out but can’t be arsed. Yeah i’m in a mad flap over it

Edited June 14, 20222 yr by Corbett80

8 hours ago, Solidsoul said:

Nice happy post!!

 Start your own venue and play the music you like! Build up a following and something positive may come out of it!

 

8 hours ago, Solidsoul said:

Did chalky not start "lifeline" at the stables venue off the M6?? If yes, he started it, played the music he liked and it was the best rare, under played soul night around...went a few times, very good!!...hope I'm right? Thank you....Rob

 

 

 

Edited June 14, 20222 yr by Lionelonthevinyl

1 hour ago, Lionelonthevinyl said:

 

One of the most significant allnighters of the last 15 years

Edited June 14, 20222 yr by Geeselad

1 hour ago, Lionelonthevinyl said:

 

 

I didn't start it that was Andy & Mick, I promoted it for them and Djed at every night bar two.

Lookalike reissue on record day at rough trade recrods  so collectors are offloading 

 

IMO

On 14/06/2022 at 10:44, Wheelsville1 said:

I dont know what people are flapping about,unless the quantity found is the same as Danny Moore of which i very much doubt then they will disappear. Take the Four Tracks,people on here said they would not touch them with a barge pole when they were £250 each,try getting one for that now.I bought a Cautions-No other way in mint condition for £600 when that small quantity turned up,you could add another £1k to that now.

 

 

add clara hardy to that chris... way more copies of this than the four tracks sold via 3 sellers from hamtramck..bottomed out at £60... back up to a grand again

i heard a 25 count box via 1 seller at austin.. whether thats true time will tell.. what i do know tho is as soon as the rumour wheels start turnin guys will panic sell as its the £££ that count and not the love of the record

On 22/06/2022 at 17:34, Dave Pinch said:

add clara hardy to that chris... way more copies of this than the four tracks sold via 3 sellers from hamtramck..bottomed out at £60... back up to a grand again

i heard a 25 count box via 1 seller at austin.. whether thats true time will tell.. what i do know tho is as soon as the rumour wheels start turnin guys will panic sell as its the £££ that count and not the love of the record

I agree Dave,the same happend when the Bobby Klines turned up.I remember people off loading their copies for £300.Its now around 2k. One record however that never really bounced back was Ann Perry,i don't know why as the east coast bell sound copies are totally legit. 

Royal Esquires and Dream Team another two examples....

2 hours ago, Wheelsville1 said:

I agree Dave,the same happend when the Bobby Klines turned up.I remember people off loading their copies for £300.Its now around 2k. One record however that never really bounced back was Ann Perry,i don't know why as the east coast bell sound copies are totally legit. 

i have the local detroit press.. you never see either today ..underplayed and under valued today in my opinion

19 minutes ago, Dave Pinch said:

i have the local detroit press.. you never see either today ..underplayed and under valued today in my opinion

I have the bell sound copy,i bought it for £20 when they turned up.Yes defo under played and under valued. Prior to the bell sound copies turning up in the early 80s,the west coast circa rosette copy was fetching £60 at that same time you could get the professionals for the same price. Food for thought. 

Bobby Kline bottomed out at £100, Hyperions at sub 200 when only a few turned up from Skeeny - its always been the same and remember people stopped playing and buying anything that had been re-released or booted back from the beginning - I bought loads of post boot originals as dj's / collectors off loaded to fund newer discoveries over 50 yrs ago, only to off-load myself when I got fed up with things. 

Clara Hardy as stated and Betty Lloyd all hit rock bottom but powered back up as the realisation of quality and real world rarity prevailed.

Follow the leader playlists and a majority of dj's who wouldn't even begin to understand the chronological order of discoveries or venue / dj playlists from history and there place in the development of the scene and who more importantly are stuck in the 'you scratch my back / I'll scratch your back' dj line-ups at most local gigs, resulting in dire playlists full of early / mid 60's British pop artists featuring heavily 

Can you imagine piling into the car to head 100 + miles to hear the latest big sounds if it was of the standard most local soul nights offer up nowadays - buying the current big-buzz must have / big ticket 45 oldie is driven by all reasons stated earlier in this thread and it'll only be on to the next one soon enough.

Watch out for : Ghetto Boys - Hand Writing / Mr. Dunn - Something / John Bowie - You're gonna  (already reappearing and rocketing) to name but 3 - The only plus point on these 3 is that they are beyond the compass or knowledge of most local jocks as well as all being blinders 

 

A little off topic but talk of Bobby kline made me pull mine and play it, are all labels reversed? 

Still so good 👍 

2 minutes ago, Skegsoul said:

A little off topic but talk of Bobby kline made me pull mine and play it, are all labels reversed? 

Still so good 👍 

No,most are the right way round.There was a small quantity found several years ago of which several had the labels reversed and several had the b side label on both sides. 

1 hour ago, Wheelsville1 said:

No,most are the right way round.There was a small quantity found several years ago of which several had the labels reversed and several had the b side label on both sides. 

It's a proper record, just hammered by DJs with no imagination 

The flip of Bobby Kline has loads of legs in it still ,and arguably the better side .

back on thread = Guitar Ray - never owned one until found one in USA a couple of weeks ago £700 so bought it. More like it on price - certainly for me