So we have Riker releasing a range of AI Soul tunes in a variety of styles. Opinions please, tin hats on lads! 💣

 

Is it worse than the cherub cheeked fat lad  from Blackpool"s most dire efforts? or the way forward, will butch be hammering them at the 100 club? 😁

Edited November 13, 2024Nov 13 by Geeselad

1 minute ago, Geeselad said:

So we have Riker releasing a range of AI Soul tunes in a variety of styles. Opinions please, tin hats on lads! 💣

I wandered how long before we had a thread about this.

 

been listening to the tracks on deans show now for some weeks and they are very good.

 

made by somebody who has listened to a lot of soul music.  He was quite open and honest in the show about them.

 

maybe get some real singers involved ?

We've already had a thread from Mike on the subject ... interestingly the YT channel got chopped soon after the thread ... 

 

Apologies, I hadn't seen the other thread please feel free to merge if needed. 

I missed that as well…..

They need burying not merging ... 

They are not 100% AI, Colin did write them all. I think some of them are fantastic.  Lenny and The illustrators and the Betty J are brilliant. 

Riker Records website here

https://www.rikerrecords.com/

 

youtube clip

 

 

Lot's of stuff by a "Michael Harris" on Traxsource.

It was being lauded up by some very respected people on Facebook but they needed their ears syringing I reckon.  Listen via headphones and it's sh!t!!  BV's a particular give away, very synthetic & shrill.

In that particular instance at least, it was a no from me and I'll accept any technology as long as the music is good.

 

Cheers,

Mark R

57 minutes ago, Mike said:

Riker Records website here

https://www.rikerrecords.com/

 

youtube clip

 

 

Any link to the Kimberlite Release from Jett Straker of the same record from a few years back??

4 minutes ago, Micksmix said:

Any link to the Kimberlite Release from Jett Straker of the same record from a few years back??

same title but diff song yep?

https://kimberliterecords.bandcamp.com/album/cause-im-ready-b-w-one-thing-i-know

8 minutes ago, Mike said:

same title but diff song yep?

https://kimberliterecords.bandcamp.com/album/cause-im-ready-b-w-one-thing-i-know

Sounds like the same song, with different production? Just my opinion though

5 hours ago, Mike said:

 

 

Jeezus christ, that's the tune that sparked a 250+ comment  thread on facebook a couple of months ago when Andy Tats Taylor posted a clip of it and we all tried to figure out who the artist was! So it's AI? That's an absolutely phonomenal tune regardless, I must say.

4 hours ago, Micksmix said:

Sounds like the same song, with different production? Just my opinion though

Similar hook but not the same song/lyrics.

13 minutes ago, Sebastian said:

Jeezus christ, that's the tune that sparked a 250+ comment  thread on facebook a couple of months ago when Andy Tats Taylor posted a clip of it and we all tried to figure out who the artist was! So it's AI? That's an absolutely phonomenal tune regardless, I must say.

I think exactly the same it’d incredible plenty of haters.

 

if this was done with a human singer it would be getting far more credit.

 

its real musicians and lyrics written by a human.

Edited November 14, 2024Nov 14 by Dylan

Sorry, never been into "tailor made" stuff, that includes the "back in the day" Mecca stuff, obviously back then the technology wasn't there, but same intentions, depends on your perspective I suppose, but hearing, or finding something you haven't heard before, and there's still a bottomless pit, from the "US ghetto,s" is an unbeatable experience, but, horses for courses, just an honest opinion 

Kev

The tunes played on Dean's show were absolutely mega. Does anyone know which aspects of the tracks is actually AI?

Very Tricky, my ears are saying YES!  My thoughts on AI are saying NO! 

Ive always told people Ive tried to keep one foot firmly on ther analogue world, and for good reason, but if it sounds good, it's good right? and these tracks do sound 'Oh so good'!

19 minutes ago, washlively said:

The tunes played on Dean's show were absolutely mega. Does anyone know which aspects of the tracks is actually AI?

Just the vocal as I understand it

 

which is a key part of soul music as people who have lived through something will get that emotion into the song.

59 minutes ago, Dylan said:

Just the vocal as I understand it

 

which is a key part of soul music as people who have lived through something will get that emotion into the song.

No live appearances anytime soon I would imagine.

Unless they go down the hologram route.

"Keep soul music real"

1 hour ago, Dylan said:

Just the vocal as I understand it

 

which is a key part of soul music as people who have lived through something will get that emotion into the song.

Cheers pal

4 hours ago, Dylan said:

Just the vocal as I understand it

 

which is a key part of soul music as people who have lived through something will get that emotion into the song.

But he has lived through the emotions in the lyrics he wrote

14 hours ago, Chalky said:

They are not 100% AI, Colin did write them all. I think some of them are fantastic.  Lenny and The illustrators and the Betty J are brilliant. 

Wow, fascinating stuff, and as Chalky says, the Lenny and the Illustrators sounds brilliant. I had a quick look at the website and subscribed to their emails - had to tick a checkbox to prove I'm human 🤣

On 14/11/2024 at 04:27, Chalky said:

They are not 100% AI, Colin did write them all. I think some of them are fantastic.  Lenny and The illustrators and the Betty J are brilliant. 

 

On 14/11/2024 at 13:34, washlively said:

The tunes played on Dean's show were absolutely mega. Does anyone know which aspects of the tracks is actually AI?

 

On 14/11/2024 at 13:55, Dylan said:

Just the vocal as I understand it

 

which is a key part of soul music as people who have lived through something will get that emotion into the song.

 

just to keep things clear, from what I have read above,  the 'vocal' of Lenny and the i's is AI generated, but the backing track is via real musicians? 

anyone confirm for sure that's 100% right?

On 14/11/2024 at 07:04, Mike said:

Riker Records website here

https://www.rikerrecords.com/

 

youtube clip

 

 

I've listened to far worse than this.

Peter

The Lenny and the illustrators is obviously brilliant and I'm fascinated by the debate. It raise so many ethical questions, personally I'd sooner people pursue a naturally developing sound through dancefloor reception than trying to recreate a mythical golden age through technology. 

17 hours ago, Mike said:

 

 

 

just to keep things clear, from what I have read above,  the 'vocal' of Lenny and the i's is AI generated, but the backing track is via real musicians? 

anyone confirm for sure that's 100% right?

anyone confirm?

47 minutes ago, Mike said:

anyone confirm?

The story of these records is told by Alan Day on the Dean Anderson show dated 31st of October 2024 posted on Soul Source by Chalky, the last hour contains the segment and all the info.

1 hour ago, Shinehead said:

The story of these records is told by Alan Day on the Dean Anderson show dated 31st of October 2024 posted on Soul Source by Chalky, the last hour contains the segment and all the info.

for real?

too much for you to do a quick summary eh?

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, Mike said:

for real?

too much for you to do a quick summary eh?

 

 

 

Thought people might be interested enough to hear from the horses mouth.

For real.

6 minutes ago, Shinehead said:

Thought people might be interested enough to hear from the horses mouth.

For real.

nah

just after a quick summary on what is 'real' and what is not on this track 

as that could actually play a major part in the discussion!

expecting people to go off and dig out a segment  on a radio show elsewhere before commenting, ain't gonna do the discussion any good..

thanks for your help anyway

anyone else out there like to pass on a quick summary of what is 'real' and what is 'not' about this track

My understanding is this.

Real session musicians were used to form the backbone of the music, the Northern/60’s feel and arrangements were created using AI wizardry. The lyrics were written by Colin, but all vocals were completely AI generated.

I think Colin’s honest big reveal well-ahead of any 45s being released for general sale was a wise decision. 

56 minutes ago, Mike said:

nah

just after a quick summary on what is 'real' and what is not on this track 

as that could actually play a major part in the discussion!

expecting people to go off and dig out a segment  on a radio show elsewhere before commenting, ain't gonna do the discussion any good..

thanks for your help anyway

anyone else out there like to pass on a quick summary of what is 'real' and what is 'not' about this track

My contribution was based on what was said on the radio show.

 

real musicians, human written, AI vocals 

11 minutes ago, Soul16 said:

My understanding is this.

Real session musicians were used to form the backbone of the music, the Northern/60’s feel and arrangements were created using AI wizardry. The lyrics were written by Colin, but all vocals were completely AI generated.

I think Colin’s honest big reveal well-ahead of any 45s being released for general sale was a wise decision. 

 

11 minutes ago, Dylan said:

My contribution was based on what was said on the radio show.

 

real musicians, human written, AI vocals 

thanks, that should hopefully help any further discussion 👍

Over the years many have produced “tailor made” efforts for the soul scene. So in this respect it’s no different. I think the difference here is that the tracks are actually good. 👍 

There is also ‘neo soul’ releases by the dozen every week that seek to mimic the sound of the sixties and seventies, and fail more often than not in my view. 

AI is here and here to stay. At work they have provided us with AI tools to write emails and documents, should we wish to use them. AI is being integrated into our products and solutions. In short it’s here now and will only grow in the coming years and we need to understand that. Even this sites hosting platform will probably have AI engines embedded for ‘enhanced functionality and user experience’.

Just my thoughts.
 

 

Built a fence today no AI help  ,listened to deans show at the time , I wont be bothering with this crap Riker Records ??? got to be joking whats  the conection there , you spend over 50 years  doing this and up comes another one, just like 74/75 -  stop press - AI at the Albert Hall

Not my cup of tea but there is very little new stuff that I care for to be truthful 

How long until venues start putting “NO AI” on the flyers… 🤔

Doesn’t do anything for me personally. It just doesn’t sound right. I can’t relate to it and I wouldn’t have a true connection to the song when I’m on the dancefloor if it’s a voice generated by an algorithm.

There's still loads of untapped Og vinyl still out there, you don't need to be trying to find killa dancefloor stuff, it's a case of getting of our arses and looking, there's no need to resort to a Soul-less option, like I mentioned before, same as the "tailor made " stuff that came out on vinyl back in the day, does nowt for me 

Kev

53 minutes ago, Kev Cane said:

There's still loads of untapped Og vinyl still out there, you don't need to be trying to find killa dancefloor stuff, it's a case of getting of our arses and looking, there's no need to resort to a Soul-less option, like I mentioned before, same as the "tailor made " stuff that came out on vinyl back in the day, does nowt for me 

Kev

 Loads of people seem to be excepting it, strange thing about this stuff is everything has got a human element except the vocals how bizarre is that soul records without a soul singer  (how does that work ) which are not instrumental.

 

Edited November 17, 2024Nov 17 by Shinehead

7 hours ago, Kev Cane said:

There's still loads of untapped Og vinyl still out there, you don't need to be trying to find killa dancefloor stuff, it's a case of getting of our arses and looking, there's no need to resort to a Soul-less option, like I mentioned before, same as the "tailor made " stuff that came out on vinyl back in the day, does nowt for me 

Kev

I was speaking with one of the fellas involved with Crawdaddy outside the Blue Posts a few months ago and he said there'd been over 7 million + tracks (or something to the power of that) released & recorded between 1967 - 1977 so really were only still scratching the surface when you think about it, so stuff like this just rubs me up the wrong way and kind of defeats the object of one of the most interesting and integral parts of the history of the scene, which is finding records. To circumnavigate that process is lazy in a word and will obviously never hold a candle to authentic records from the periods they try to replicate, just another thing to scroll past in the algorithm.

Edited November 17, 2024Nov 17 by Clee93

I've come back to this thread after following the Ai Poll thread. I don't know how many have listened to the actual podcast, I hadn't until yesterday and I have to say it did make me think a bit more deeply about the subject. It didn't change my opinion of how I voted which was "depends" based on as long as there is no intention to deceive you can take it or leave it. 

    I did find Colin very personable and his explanation of his intentions for me threw a different light on the project. I found it to be  a very enjoyable hour of new music, most I liked a couple were so so but that would have been my take on a normal hour of listening. Something was nagging at me whilst listening which I could not put my finger on until when it ended I put on some records,can't remember what exactly though one was a male vocal, great as the tunes were and yes I would probably buy the Lenny and the Illustrators were it to appear as a single for me the warmth in the voice was missing. Those little inflections that catch you unawares and stir something inside. 

   I believe as with the Michael Parkinson interviews using Ai that it is possible to clone a voice, here is where I see potential to deceive , how long before someone with the wherewithal to own the latest technology clones lets say Chuck Jackson's and comes up with an unreleased unearthed acetate. The good thing about that is with the internet and wealth of knowledge that exists it maybe would not take long for the truth to be exposed as people searched for the provenance.

    I would say to anyone who has not listened to the whole podcast and has judged these particular tracks purely on the sound bites on the Riker site to listen to Colin's explanations and the stories behind why he did the tunes. It probably won't change you opinion of Ai or these in particular  but it will give a better understanding of his project. 

    Looking to the future, much rather this than the travesty (IMHO) that is the Jeffries and Early remix call it what you will of Al Green's Let's Stay Together,listen at your peril.

https://www.youtube.com/@HilariouslyRealMusic/videos

It will never replace what I've collected, danced to and Djed with just about all my life.  But when has the scene been about just Soul music?  (I know collecting is far greater in depth).

9 hours ago, Chalky said:

It will never replace what I've collected,

Me neither Karl, and I wouldn't want it to, neither does the small amount of 80's/90's indie and Electronic plus 60's pop I own but they do serve to give and reinforce the real passion that I have and get from all genres of Soul music that like you i have listened to and collected for over 60yrs.

  Nothing music wise can replace the thrill I still get and the memory of hearing for the first time the likes of the first bars of Shirley and the Shirelles , Bob Kuban the Contours, dropping the needle on Millie Jackson's  Caught Up album and phoning my mate to tell him he had to drop everything and come round now for a listen, plus countless others that were my introduction to this fabulous music.

  As I said above, at this moment in time I would probably,buy the Lenny track were it released, then again down the line when it comes to actually pressing the "pay now " button after scrolling through my wants list I possibly won't.  

On 07/12/2024 at 15:07, souljoe said:

https://www.youtube.com/@HilariouslyRealMusic/videos

It's not bad is it, but something about the drums sounds off to me, the lyrics too. But yeah if you heard that playing out somewhere you wouldn't immediately guess it was AI would you.

 

On 09/12/2024 at 14:35, Timillustrator said:

you wouldn't immediately guess it was AI would you.

As I didn't with this one when it came up on a link, I was intrigued by the artists name so had a look on Discogs and Musicstack drawing a blank on both. Looked at the comments on YouTube where the guy who posted it admitted they wrote the songs and created the music and imagery using various AI tools.

  Looks like a slippery slope to me

 

1 hour ago, Twoshoes said:

As I didn't with this one when it came up on a link, I was intrigued by the artists name so had a look on Discogs and Musicstack drawing a blank on both. Looked at the comments on YouTube where the guy who posted it admitted they wrote the songs and created the music and imagery using various AI tools.

  Looks like a slippery slope to me

 

Its poor to my ears as is everything else on the their YT channel. Looks like its creeping out though. I've already seen a playlist from a "Playlist Group" on FB featuring a Riker track. 

On 14/11/2024 at 04:27, Chalky said:

They are not 100% AI, Colin did write them all. I think some of them are fantastic.  Lenny and The illustrators and the Betty J are brilliant. 

Will they be live on TOTP? (Joke)

Now, just discussing, as we're too busy dancing when we're out.

Live gigs is where the money isso l guess most popular genres will likely abstain? To me only the NS genre can do this as the 60s stuff we love is past performing be it age or passing and it's the 45s we love.

This vid is pretty new.

lf you fancy a go at it just visit one of the many apps online, put in a few lyrics and a genre and see what comes out. Then all you need is a NS sounding name...Solomon & the Berks? (No offence) Peter Kay would have a ball with this.

Tin hat is firmly in place. 🤣

 

An element of the discussion thats overlooked is why anyone would want to do this? As a commercial venture I'm afraid it's doomed to fail, look how many labour of love small labels put out stuff to little claim with little financial compensation. Without the added issue of wether it's credible to it's market because of the way it was produced. We really need machines to a style of music that's about human qualities? 

Mili Vanilli on Soul Train comes to mind. (The scandal of lip sync.)