Guest dundeedavie Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 as they say 'ignorance is bliss' the buyer thinks they are getting an original.... why not just let them? if they were a dj they would have done their research..... if they are a wannabee dj then it serves them right Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
purist Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Why is everyone assuming the buyer isn't aware it's a boot/2nd issue - just because they've paid rather a lot of money for it ? Last "proper" one that I saw go through ebay about a year back was 4616, so maybe the buyer just wants one that looks the same, and is happy to have paid a tenth of what the "proper" one fetched ? I think there's more than just a few who like to pretend they've got " real " records when they've only got lookalikes, and this pressing is a case of 'looks the same at a distance' (try asking some so called DJ's if you can look at their records when they take them off the decks, as I've done, and often they don't want to show you because they know you're calling them out on playing boots) Last thought, in every walk of life you pay to learn. If it is a case of an ill informed buyer then they've paid to learn. Equally they could have bought a bootleg guide which would have cost somewhat less but again it wouldn't have been free, so they'd have paid to learn that way too. Anybody who's collected for any amount of time has been 'turned over', not always on purpose by the seller, but be honest if you've never bought a boot for a real record then my guess is you never lived through the scene in the 70's because we were all conned back then. The onus is on the buyer, there's been thousands of examples of misinformation on ebay since it started, we've discussed hundreds on this forum, smart folk as questions, and if you don't ask, then bid 300 in hope, you are a fool. My favourite quote to apply to any transaction, not just records, is " If something looks too good to be true, it usually is ". 300 for a real Tomangoes ? Do me a favour.... 3 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Dazdakin Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Think I have read all the posts on this subject and there is one thing that I don't think has been mentioned. Agreed, slightly suspect on his description yet there is not one outright lie been told. And we on here who know just by looking at picture whether or not its an original ( I do and sure most others do also ) will not be tempted to bid just in case. But am I the only person thinking that the highest bidder may well know just as much as I or others do on here and may well be very happy with the price he is gonna pay knowing that its a 70,s lookalike? Therefore with the knowledge he (may) have, is not being conned. Everybody happy, no harm done. Just a thought. Dazz 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest Droylsdonian Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Thing is that this pressing is very poor quality - or, at least, all the copies I've heard are. If it is VG+, it won't be for long & the poor (rich) buyer will be expecting Neil Armstrong's 'One small step for man...' after the intro. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mick Reed Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Could this be his mates bidding it up givin the impression and creating interest that it is an original ?.If not f-=kin crazy. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest son of stan Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) It's a fascinating situation isn't it? To be fair though, Ebay is an auction site - 'sold to the highest bidder' and that... Can't understand really why folk are getting all cross with the seller (not me honest!)... Can't see what he's done to create an impression it is worth this price. He's auctioning his records...presumably with the objective of making a few quid.... What is he meant to do? Step in and call time when the bidding goes past his estimation of 'a fair price'....? Edited July 19, 2013 by son of stan Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Premium Stuff Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) It's a fascinating situation isn't it? To be fair though, Ebay is an auction site - 'sold to the highest bidder' and that... Can't understand really why folk are getting all cross with the seller (not me honest!)... Can't see what he's done to create an impression it is worth this price. He's auctioning his records... What is he meant to do? Step in and call time when the bidding goes past his estimation of 'a fair price'....? Think the real issue is that the description is wrong as it suggests a Monarch stamp is a Nashville stamp. So anyone who knows that Nashville means authentic is possibly being misled - whether intended or not. Richard Edited July 19, 2013 by Premium Stuff Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest son of stan Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) Think the real issue us that the description us wrong as it suggests a Monarch stamp is a Nashville stam. So anyone who knows that Nashville means authentic being misled - whether intended or not. Richard Ok. Didn't get that bit. Is that how you tell an original from a boot with this one? In which case its deception (or myopia!) Don't ask me, tho... My copy got pinched loooooooong before the internet existed to verify these matters! Edited July 19, 2013 by son of stan Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Mak Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) Seller is Tim Croxford from Dust , Northants. ................ Edited July 20, 2013 by mike post edited as per terms of use 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest son of stan Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) Burn the fake Tomangoes witch! Edited July 19, 2013 by son of stan Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest chrislokeh Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 IM ALWAYS IN 2 MINDS ON THIS - DEVIOUS SELLER ,,,OR STUPID BUYER - IF IM BUYING A RECORD FOR A LOT OF MONEY I WOULD WANT TO EXACTELY WHAT IM BUYING....YOU CANT BUY KNOWLEDGE Its got to be a stupid buyer Mark or somebody whose got too much money.Sometimes we don,t look at the big picture.I once bought a Major Lance before photos were used and thought it was a bargin and when it arrived it had a little 45 DOH!!! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Len Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 He gives the delta number and of course anyone who knows about delta numbers can date it to around 1975 - except us record nerds are in the minority and the general buying public don't know about these things. Don't put ya self down Pete Len Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Len Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 (edited) When I first started collecting as a youngster I didn't even know what had been bootlegged let alone the differences between boots and originals. It was pre-internet and pre-bootleg guide days too. Therefore, I always bought stuff from big name dealers at the time to be sure I was getting originals - the usual suspects, and I won't name them in case it upsets anyone. I sometimes look back at a few of the records I still have that I bought at the time and there are a few that stick out now as bootlegs - even though they were bought as originals. One that is obvious now is The Royal 5 on Tyler. Still pisses me off as all records were listed as originals. That said, I have not made my mind up about sellers these days giving all the details of the actual record for sale to allow a knowledgeable buyer to see what is being sold is a bootleg (which should not be sold on eBay anyway, which for some will be reason not to say 'bootleg'). Worth comparing to what happens in life when you compare record buying to other areas like buying a holiday, or a house or a car. There's a lot in caveat emptor. Cheers Richard I remember reading a record list with one of my records on it for £200.00! - I rang up the dealer saying I had one, and would he want to buy it - He was so sweet!......Len, has it got any numbers stamped on the grove?" ......."Um, no - none at all"....."I think that may be a pressing mate"......"A what?"....... - He fully explained, and thanked me for the call, bless him......You live and learn Len Edited July 19, 2013 by LEN 2 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
pogo paul Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Someone could always put in a super mad bid in for it and have the seller wetting himself, then when it comes to paying just tell him to feck off, i know for a fact e bay do jack shit about non payers if they happen to generate even a moderate amount of money on their site! This is probably the true story. or a mate bidding it up! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest CARL D Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Currently £324!!? Surely they'll realise(or have already)the c*ck-up they've made,and let the seller know? And there's a buy it now for £4.99, and two on auction at £8.50 and £9.99, so far.....why don't they thoroughly check listings f.f.s?? A check on popsike shows the cheapest sold last year at £18, the highest at £125 in 2009, and various other amounts in between. There's also a Magicians-Sweet Magic at £81.99, with roughly 12 hrs to go.....cheers, Carl. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Robbk Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Can't blame the seller, a fool and thier momey are often parted. How much is my Grapevien worth? At least thats legit... Yes you CAN blame the seller. He KNEW it was pressed at Monarch in the mid '70s, and that the original was a mid '60s release. He SHOULD have stated that it was a re-release. Further, he emphasized the NR as Nashville Matrix, to IMPLY that providing this information PROVES it was an original pressing. That is FRAUD, pure and simple. When one is selling something, IF he knows it is not an original, it is his duty to say so. I can't believe that this experienced dealer really thought it was an original mid '60s release. 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Orotava Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 I just wonder what his start price was - you don`t get to £324 in 7 bids unless it was pretty hefty to begin with. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
kevinsoulman Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 DOES NOT ACCEPT RETURNS EITHER KEV Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest son of stan Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 I just wonder what his start price was - you don`t get to £324 in 7 bids unless it was pretty hefty to begin with. It was £1.99. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Linky Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Jumped from £2.19 to £100 in one bid - and then £102 to £200 - £202 to £299. One of the bidders has a feedback score of 2642! Surely he knows it's a boot. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Pete S Posted July 20, 2013 Author Share Posted July 20, 2013 Jumped from £2.19 to £100 in one bid - and then £102 to £200 - £202 to £299. One of the bidders has a feedback score of 2642! Surely he knows it's a boot. Or he's just bumping it for the seller? 2 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Kevinkent Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 (edited) Seller is Tim Croxford from Dust , Northants. ................ That will be DUSTON, Northampton, Pete. Same place that promoter Paddy Grady resides. Edited July 20, 2013 by modernsoulsucks Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Chalky Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Or he's just bumping it for the seller? Think there's definitely some Shill bidding going on. Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest manusf3a Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Someone could always put in a super mad bid in for it and have the seller wetting himself, then when it comes to paying just tell him to feck off, i know for a fact e bay do jack shit about non payers if they happen to generate even a moderate amount of money on their site! Way to go ! Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
hullsoul Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Or he's just bumping it for the seller? That sounds favourite to me too Pete. Cheers Martyn Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Pete S Posted July 20, 2013 Author Share Posted July 20, 2013 Here's another nasty one...can't even be bothered to do the correct label https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BOBBY-KLINE-SAY-SOMETING-NICE-TO-ME-LARRY-WEISS-454-N-S-TOP-500-/380675868126?pt=UK_Records&hash=item58a20cc5de 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
spot Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 (edited) Just go look at his other sales items, there all re-issues or boots, so are that guys Pete & some have auto bids on them. Spot. Edited July 20, 2013 by spot Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
kevinsoulman Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Here's another nasty one...can't even be bothered to do the correct label https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BOBBY-KLINE-SAY-SOMETING-NICE-TO-ME-LARRY-WEISS-454-N-S-TOP-500-/380675868126?pt=UK_Records&hash=item58a20cc5de AND £2.25 POSTAGE TOO PETE Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Premium Stuff Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 This is the sellers email from his listing if anyone wants to drop him a line: makintime452@hotmail.co.uk Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ernie Andrews Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 (edited) No reply to my question of Styrene or Vinyl? that was 48 hours ago Edited July 20, 2013 by Ernie Andrews Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Peter99 Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 This is the sellers email from his listing if anyone wants to drop him a line: makintime452@hotmail.co.ukFcuk it - I'll mail the guy! Peter 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Peter99 Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Fcuk it - I'll mail the guy! PeterSent 2 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Premium Stuff Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Sent Bet you don't get a reply Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Peter99 Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Bet you don't get a reply I might get a fcuk off! I just told him that I knew that he knew that it was a counterfeit. 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Swifty Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 I might get a fcuk off! I just told him that I knew that he knew that it was a counterfeit. go on my son ! 2 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Ernie Andrews Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Ive just asked him about the Nashville in the deadwax Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Geordiejohnson Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 the thing to do is everyone who feels the guys out of line...and he is misleading in his description..... is contact the seller via ebay if he gets a shed load of contacts from various persons all hounding him about it being a boot he might withdraw it before auction end tomorrow and the buyer mwy be saved...... the buyer, i dont think is a fool as some have intimated, may not be armed with all the information to know its a boot...weve all been duped in the past......... Geeoooooordie 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Premium Stuff Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 I already messaged him on ebay and due to no reply have reported it to ebay Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Guest dundeedavie Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 i dont think is a fool as some have intimated, may not be armed with all the information to know its a boot...weve all been duped in the past......... Geeoooooordie and yet he's spending £300+ on a tune he isn't armed with information on? Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
sepia Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 looking @ his bad feedback,he sends records 2nd class even though winners paid for 1st class. hope he sends this rare record special delivery or the winner will be shafted twice Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Rudzy Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 item number 141016364933 sorry for some reason I can't paste the link but it's a bootleg of The Tomangoes and it's currently at £304, surely the highest price ever for a pressing? OUTRAGEOUS Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Modernsoulsucks Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Just a quickie.Mike edited an earlier post. I've just edited a few more.Let's keep to a more neutral tone as to seller's motivation or proclivity and avoid the c word.ROD [Forum Moderator] Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Rudzy Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 OUTRAGEOUS I will sell you mine for £200 mate Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Frankie Crocker Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 Clearly a case of mis-representing the facts aka lying by omission. However, if the bidder is aware the record is not an original and has the funds to burn, then he is entitled to spend whatever he wants - somehow, I doubt this is the case so it could be collectors bidding heftily because a previous high bid seemed to 'authenticate' the record's provenance. This sort of salesmanship is unethical and bad for the scene - if the vendor has any scruples, he will withdraw the item and re- list it. Like Premium Stuff, I could reel off a list of fakes bought from a high ranking English dealer but that's for another thread... Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Premium Stuff Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 (edited) Just got this message back. "Hi I go away for a couple of days and this listing went ballistic! I had no intention of deceiving and I have now cancelled all bids and put in the description that it is 2nd pressing (as I cant list the word bootleg or counterfeit). Regards. Tim" Edited July 20, 2013 by Premium Stuff 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Peter99 Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 (edited) Just got this message back. "Hi I go away for a couple of days and this listing went ballistic! I had no intention of deceiving and I have now cancelled all bids and put in the description that it is 2nd pressing (as I cant list the word bootleg or counterfeit). Regards. Tim" He replied to me as well. "This has been rather odd, as all I have put on the listing is the info on the record I havent confirmed that it is an original as I always steer clear of that as there were so many boots"! Peter Edited July 20, 2013 by Peter99 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Swifty Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 (edited) It's back down to £1.99 , but if some idiot is prepared to pay £300 for a record they would surely (hopefully) do their homework as I can't imagine a new person on the scene would blow that much money on a record (wish I could ) but agree the seller left it open to confuse people (allegedly) and I suppose if the buyer has looked on Anglo or in JM book and seen what it's really worth as an original , then you may think you've found a holy grail !!! Swifty p.s. tried 4 different spellings of allededg...... but you know what I mean if any solicitors are looking p.p.s.edited - thanks Mr. Premium Stuff Edited July 20, 2013 by SWIFTY Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Premium Stuff Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 It's back down to £1.99 , but if some idiot is prepared to pay £300 for a record they would surely (hopefully) do their homework as I can't imagine a new person on the scene would blow that much money on a record (wish I could ) but agree the seller left it open to confuse people (aledgedley) and I suppose if the buyer has looked on Anglo or in JM book and seen what it's really worth as an original , then you may think you've found a holy grail !!! Swifty p.s. tried 4 different spellings of allededg...... but you know what I mean if any solicitors are looking Allegedly 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Peter99 Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 In fairnesss to the seller he has relisted and said it's a second pressing and all of the old bids have been cancelled. So, we will now see if the buyer was willing to pay 300 quid for a record which they DID know was a boot but wanted it anyway. The Which team of SS! Peter 1 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Soulmanau Posted July 20, 2013 Share Posted July 20, 2013 All bids cancelled on the item and relisted as a pressing. more power to SS 2 Link to comment Social source share More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Get involved with Soul Source
Add your comments now
Join Soul Source
A free & easy soul music affair!
Join Soul Source now!Log in to Soul Source
Jump right back in!
Log in now!